performance enhancers

[skibum_]

I consistently go to the gym and have been hearing a lot about creatine. Apparently it allows you to hold more water in your body and helps with muscle developement. Does anyone have any opinions on whether it would be benficial to take while planting or whether dangerous. And if it would be bad to have it in your system at all while planting.

Caffeine, a lot of people on my crew hit the coffee before the day, but I never drink coffee in the real world, so I didnt planting. Does it negatively or positively effect your day?

[gumby]

Definitely don't take creatine. Its not good for you, and if your muscles have protein overload you can get all sorts of problems. The type of protein thats in creatine isnt the best for your body-- if you are after more protein eat some more meat at supper and eat those eggs for breakfast. Planting puts your entire body into overdrive- eat lots, digest lots, crap lots, and of course work like a maniac and sleep as much as you can too- when things are being pushed to the max like that you dont want to be experimenting wit potentially harmful stuff, cause any negative effects will be all the more intense.
As for coffee- well, its not nearly as bad as creatine. But by time you get to the block, the effects have usually worn off,. Also, its a diuretic so it dehydrates you. I know that a lot of people are used to drinking it, and its probably not too horrible for them, but if you dont drink it in the real world then theres not a whole lot of point to starting in the bush.

Thats my 2 cents. Im a nursing student, btw, so i know what I'm talking about.

[Freelancer]

I plan on bringing Endurox R4 with me planting. It is widely used in endurance athletics, most famously by Lance Armstrong. It is not a drug of any kind but rather a mix of protein, insulin, and carbs which help to rebuild muscle after a workout. Apparently the insulin is the key to muscle regrowth. Heres the website explanation:

Endurox® R4® Recovery Drink was developed by leading exercise physiologists and based on landmark research redefining how the exercising muscle recovers. Endurox R4 contains the patented 4 to1 ratio of carbohydrate to protein to speed muscle glycogen replenishment and rebuild muscle protein after exercise, antioxidants to reduce post-exercise muscle damage and glutamine to help reduce muscle stress.

In clinical studies against the leading sports Endurox R4 was found to:

* Increased mean performance up to 66%
* Reduced total free radical buildup by 69%
* Stimulated insulin levels by 70%
* Produced equivalent rates of rehydration
* Decreased post exercise muscle damage by 36%
* Increased muscle glycogen levels 2.2 fold

Endurox R4 enables you to train harder and better the next day and everyday.

Hope this helps, Cheers

[Russ]

As far as creatine i don't see how it'd be a big help for planting. It's more geared towards explosive short term muscle power, not endurance. Also, it requires a huge water intake to really be effective which you simply don't have time for if your planting.

Last season i started taking protein shakes near the end of the season which helped recovery, i think. Also glutamine, and glucosamine & chondroitin (one product) are good supplements to look into. The former basically speeds up muscle recovery and the latter helps joint pains.

Freelancer your endurox sounds interesting, do you know if its actually used by lance armstrong or if he just endorses it? Might be worth looking into.

[skibum_]

i looked int othe endurox stuff, looks sketchy. Seems the testing for it didnt have control groups and there was only one test. They are basiing everything on those one results.

[Freelancer]

Pretty much every major enduranec supplement follows the same ration of carbs to protein now, the only difference is Endurox has insulin in it. My rationale is if its good enough to be copied by other brands, it must have some benefit to it. Every review I have read has been very positive, placebo effect or not.

[grey goose]

Some useful info can be found on the wikipedia site about creatine and other supplements. In my experience, and i have used and researched creatine, it is for developing muscular size and strength. It will have nothing to do with aerobic conditioning. Studies do show it will allow for an increase in body mass and as an aid in muscular recovery. The human body produces amounts of creatine, and we consume the rest through diet. The body stoes it to use later as for its intended purpose. As far as overdosing, you can overdose on anything under the sun, like potassium and sodium. Not altogether likely but when not used properly possible. It is not a source of protein.!!
If one were to use it for planting, it would best be used before the season as part of a doping period.(mandatory) There are forms of it that allow it to be taken in pill, liquid and powder form. Liquid I believe or the last time I checked, was a bottle with an eye dropper simply drop onto your tounge. Increased strength, maybe not planting is by nature aerobically based and has nothing to do with building anything more than muscular endurance. Yes legs get more fit, but they are merely rounding into "game shape" My professional opinion is that its benefits would be more noticeable at the end of seasons as any increased retention in body weight would allow for levels of relative strength to power through the end of a long and wearing season. (Maybe I'll do my own study this yearto see for my self.) There are plenty of studies that tell about a myriad of advantages and disadvantages. Look for objective material.
A proper diet and regular aerobic and muscular training(flexibility and strength, endurance) are the two best ways to prepare for a season. When athletes are at the top of their game they resort to supplementation. This is as well relative to the individual.
For those wondering, my proessional opinion is a degree in Phys ed. , certified fitness and lifestyle consultant with the Canadian Society for Exercise Physiology. This is all within my scope of practise. Any other questions, PM me. Thank you

[iamba]

how about speed?
or mushrooms. i always get really energetic while on shrooms.
plant tree's and see gnomes at the same time, sounds like a ball.

[Scooter]

Stimulants and caffeine have the drawback of dehydrating you, and they can only be taken in significant quantities for several days at a time before you crash fairly hard. They also make your night-time sleep less effective, so you sleep fitfully and never really get enough true rest.

[Clouch]

Redrockets were a popular item in my camp last year. They're great if you can actually keep up with the bastards but I found that they only burned me out sooner.

As for the shrooms, I love blocks where they grow naturally! Just dont let the gnomes sidetrack you!

Creatine, great for the off season while building muscle. The stuff really doesn't do anything at all for aerobic condition or endurance so it would do anything for you at all on the block. Like someone mentioned above, all it does is retain water in the muscles, but the rest of your body needs that water while planting, hard enough to stay hydrated as it is.

Protein powder/shakes, not any real huge advantage. Can help to prevent muscle loss while planting, if you go into planting with lots of muscle. Its another way to get that extra protein fast if you dont have time at the dinner table. Since most of them are water based its also another way to hydrate. Some of the flavours are a nice break from straight water or tang. I do recomend saving it for camp in the evening though simply because it does take more to digest protein over carbs. Eat carbs on the block for fast energy boosts, protein in the evening or on the way home from the block to help repair the muscles while you sleep. I actually had a bad camp cook my first year... all he ever prepared was carbs, we rarely got protein in our provided diets and it really started to show halfway through the contract.

What else? Drink lots of water is the best advice I've ever gotten. Keeps the system clean. And hey, the world is my urinal!

[daleks]

drink lotsa water before you start each days' work, and eat three or more really good meals a day.....supplements are like snake oil medicine, and they all suck....and suck the money out of your wallet at the same time.....just eat well....

[Scooter]

drink lotsa water before you start each days' work, and eat three or more really good meals a day.....supplements are like snake oil medicine, and they all suck....and suck the money out of your wallet at the same time.....just eat well....

Well put.

[skelvin00]

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[salbrecher]

Stimulants and caffeine have the drawback of dehydrating you, and they can only be taken in significant quantities for several days at a time before you crash fairly hard. They also make your night-time sleep less effective, so you sleep fitfully and never really get enough true rest.

Depending on how much caffeine you consume that may or may not be true. For the levels of caffeine that most planters would consume your statement would not be true, at least according to the most current studies. It really does depend on how much you consume and your body size though. For a big person who's 200lbs they could consume up to 400mg (4 red rooster pills) will no dehydrating effects. Here's one study but there are more if you want to look.

Clin Sports Med 26 (2007) 1–16
CAFFEINE
Caffeine and its related compounds, theophylline and theobromine, have long
been recognized as diuretic molecules [14], which encourage excretion of urine
via increased blood flow to the kidneys [15]. The recommendation that caffeine
be avoided by athletes because hydration status would be compromised [6] is
based on several studies examining the acute effects of high levels (>300 mg) of
caffeine [16]. More recent studies have tested the credibility of this recommendation
by re-examining hydration status in varying settings after short-term
caffeine intake and, for the first time, after long-term intake.
Using increased urine output as an indicator of diuresis and dehydration, early
studies showed that the threshold for an increase of urine output was 250 to 300
mg of caffeine intake [17]. Urine output was greater for the first 3 hours after ingestion
[17], but when urine was collected for 4 hours, the difference in urine output
between caffeine and placebo was negated [18].When double the caffeine was
ingested (612 mg or 8.5 mg/kg), urine volume increased over the next 4 hours
[19]. The molecular properties of caffeine do not refute the fact that it may act
as an acute diuretic, but when observations span a short time (<24 hours), it is
difficult to understand long-term changes in hydration [15].
When 24-hour urine volume is examined, the ingestion of caffeine at levels
of 1.4 to 3.1 mg/kg does not increase urine output or change hydration status
[20]. When large amounts of caffeine are ingested (8.2–10.2 mg/kg), the increases
in urine excretion vary from person to person, but may be 41% greater
than control levels [21]. It cannot be concluded from these studies that ‘‘caffeine
causes dehydration’’ because acute increases in urine volume with large caffeine
intake (>300 mg) may be offset later by decreased urine output and result
in no change in long-term hydration status [16].
Acute ingestion of caffeine before exercise (1–2 hours) at levels up to 8.7 mg/kg
does not alter urine output and fluid balance [19,22–24] when subjects exercise
at 60% to 85% VO2max for 0.5 to 3 hours [19,22–24]. The possible mechanism
for a lack of a diuretic effect with caffeine during exercise is most likely due to
an increase in catecholamines and diminished renal blood flow [19]. There is little
evidence to suggest that short-term use of caffeine alters hydration status at rest or
during exercise.
Because most Americans consume caffeine on a regular basis [15], it is surprising
that few studies have examined the effects of controlled caffeine intake
over several days. In 2004, the authors’ research team conducted a field study
involving a crossover design in which subjects exercised for 2 hours, twice
a day, for 3 consecutive days [25]. Subjects rehydrated ad libitum and consumed
a volume equal to 7 cans daily of either caffeinated or decaffeinated
soda. Throughout the 3 days, no differences of urine volume, body weight,
plasma volume, and urine specific gravity were observed between the twoconditions. The authors reported similar results in an investigation in which
subjects consumed 3 mg caffeine/kg/d for 6 days; during the following 5
days, 20 subjects decreased their intake to 0 mg/kg/d, 20 maintained intake
at 3 mg/kg/d, and 20 doubled their intake to 6 mg/kg/d [26]. Urine volume
and other markers of hydration status showed that, regardless of caffeine ingestion,
hydration status did not change throughout the 11 days (Fig. 2). Heat tolerance
and thermoregulation examined on the 12th day during exercise in
a hot environment did not differ between conditions [27].
Acute ingestion of moderate to low levels of caffeine (<300 mg) does not promote
dehydration at rest or during exercise. Long-term ingestion of low to high
levels of caffeine does not compromise hydration status and thermoregulation
at rest and during exercise. Varying one’s level of caffeine ingestion (either
increasing or decreasing) also does not seem to change hydration status
[15,16]. There is no evidence to support caffeine restriction on the basis of
impaired thermoregulation or changes of hydration status at levels less than
300–400 mg/d.

[Scooter]

Unfortunately, probably at least half of the planters I know who really try to max out on caffeine would exceed 400 mg per day.

A normal cup of coffee is usually 70-150 mg. But many cooks make it strong.

Red Bull or Red Rain is usually around 80 mg.

Most colas are 40-50 mg per can.


Coffee and pill-form stimulants tend to be the biggest problem, although I've seen people go through four or five red bulls a day, on the block alone. Not healthy. It's pretty hard to overdose on caffeine when you're drinking colas though.

[swamper]

I swear by 5 hour energy. I have taken it for 2 seasons last year I got into the habit of taking one at 12:00 and it would power me till 5:00 then I could always make through one more bag up. I like the 5 hour because it has no sugar in it so you don’t get a sugar rush crash like you do with every other energy shot. Watch out though I have now gotten so used to taking 5 hour that I can’t actually plant a day without it so be warned. 5 hour energy is something you can take that will give you tons of energy for half the day. Then there are the days that I would take 2 in a day those are the record breaking days.

[TheHamsterizer]

Creatine wont do anything for your planting, but it's harmless so whatever. The most effective supplements would be those that help recovery. Xtend might be good to mix in your water, but it's expensive as hell. Any supplement would have to be really effective to outweigh the cost of taking it. Go ahead and pound those red bulls, but remember that it's borrowed energy that you're going to have to pay back sooner or later(ie crash, sickness, dehydration). None of these drinks or stimulants 'give' you energy. I'm not trying to be preachy here, either. I have lots of experience supplementing with caffeine, ephedrine, dexedrine, and taurine. The only things I would take now are green tea extract, and weed. I feel like weed and caffeine(in moderate doses) are the only supps where the pros outweigh the cons. Everyone's different though...

[Gabe]

I think it's a personal matter of preference for most planters. Say, for example, I only need to perform at the end of a long day for a couple of hours - viagra is usually the best option, but if I want to let the moment develop naturally at some point over the next 36 then I do prefer cialis

And watch out for priapsm.

But seriously, does anyone have a good recipe for an inexpensive electrolyte replacement mix like gatorade? I know you can buy the stuff and make it yourself

[TheHamsterizer]

http://www.bloglander.com/cheapeats/200 ... de-recipe/

[Mr. Amazing]

Substitute sodium chloride with this Half-Salt stuff:
http://www.windsorsalt.com/food_salts/h ... t.html.htm
Not too sure what a lethal dose of of potassium chloride is, so beware...

[TheHamsterizer]

Thanks for the informative sharing and post. I will bookmark your link also but someone suggest me this products checkout for know better...

weird. I think a spam bot necro'd this thread. I guess that's what happens when you use terms like 'performance enhancers' on the internet.

[krahn]

how about speed? :D
or mushrooms. i always get really energetic while on shrooms.
plant tree's and see gnomes at the same time, sounds like a ball.
:D

there was a rookie girl on our crew years ago who wasn't the best planter but fairly quick, however she tried just a "bit" of shrooms one morning and put in huge numbers, afterwords she was saying how everything just starting making sense, the spacing clicked and she had a great time.

the next day the checker went over her piece and it was a travesty of epic proportions, ghost lines criss-crossing every which way. she spent that and the next day replanting.

word to the wise.

[Scooter]

it was a travesty of epic proportions,

I absolutely HAVE to use this line in a song sometime, with your permission of course.

[L'Amour]

how about speed? :D
or mushrooms. i always get really energetic while on shrooms.
plant tree's and see gnomes at the same time, sounds like a ball.
:D

there was a rookie girl on our crew years ago who wasn't the best planter but fairly quick, however she tried just a "bit" of shrooms one morning and put in huge numbers, afterwords she was saying how everything just starting making sense, the spacing clicked and she had a great time.

the next day the checker went over her piece and it was a travesty of epic proportions, ghost lines criss-crossing every which way. she spent that and the next day replanting.

word to the wise.

... and then she wrecked her tent staring at the moon, amirite?

[krahn]

... and then she wrecked her tent staring at the moon, amirite?

sometimes the moon just grips you tight and doesn't let go.

[ekim]

I use Essential Electrolytes in capsule form that i bought at the local healthfood store and I swear by them. Since taking them I never feel dehydrated, get cramps or burn out at any time of the day, even in extreme heat.

[Scooter]

I assume that you also drink a good amount of water to complement them?

[ekim]

You bet I do, I am lucky to have some of the best water in the area, and I drink 4-8L at work and another 2-3 in the sauna at night. No dehydration or cramps when using them.

I really can't recommend the Essential Electrolyes enough.

[newb]

Energy drink may be linked to 13 deaths in the U.S.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/life/the ... le5333130/

[Scooter]

Alcohol may be related to a few hundred thousand.

And come to think of it, a lot of births.

[chrisdunn]

Pepsi, and lots of it. It made me the man I am today.

[rednekhippy]

Modafinil , Armodafinil and Caffeine + Aniracetam, Oxiracetam and Choline for a mental edge, low doses of oral steroids like oxandrolone to keep you jacked and GHB before bed to stimulate endogenous growth hormone secretion to speed recovery and healing

[MattW]

Modafinil , Armodafinil and Caffeine + Aniracetam, Oxiracetam and Choline for a mental edge, low doses of oral steroids like oxandrolone to keep you jacked and GHB before bed to stimulate endogenous growth hormone secretion to speed recovery and healing

Is that a joke? Do you walk away with any money at the end of the day after buying all that shit?

If im dragging my feet I eat by 3pm I treat myself to a chocolate bar.. Maybe im underthinking it..

[Zab]

Man, the above-mentioned list of stuff plus alcohol+God knows whatever from nights off would not make me want to be the first aid attendant with a bunch of young'uns.

I am not supporting this, but on one of my last super cold, rainy fall days in late October, the sort of day where you feel frozen after you've stopped for 2 minutes, I was working with someone who took a Sudafed on the basis that he wouldn't get cold, hungry, or would have lots of energy to minimize the downtime.

I am a relatively petite girl, no super athlete, although pretty regularly athletic, and I have worked with some dudes who swear by and cant go without some of this stuff and have planted in the 5-10 seasons range, like me. Do they plant more than me? No, not necessarily and certainly not consistently. Could they outlift me? Well sure... but that's not what we are doing out there.

As Hammy said, you are borrowing energy that will have to be paid back later on..if you want to do well, go to bed early, don't get destroyed on nights off, learn when and how and what to eat, hydrate yourself, stretch, be active on the off season. There is a reason there are pamphlets available to us on these subjects.

The fact that you can buy all of these things, especially energy drinks, at Walmart, at a gas station, on the way to the block, dupes people into thinking they are safe. All of those energy concoctions are quite new, too affordable and too accessible really, even though data cannot yet exist on the longer term consequences of usage.

The grad student in me is fighting to come out a little bit here, and without trying to sound too preachy, all research isn't good research and manufacturers of such products frequently make misleading claims backed by dodgy studies.

[Scooter]

you are borrowing energy that will have to be paid back later on.

A key message. I usually collapse into a five day coma as soon as the season is over and the trucks are returned and cleaned and the final paperwork is finished, so my body finally realizes that it's OK to shut down for a bit and recover.

Another reason why sleeping on the night off, instead of getting hammered, can really make a difference in helping your body recover from the punishment of the last shift.

I know that this sounds odd coming from me, after years of burning the candle at both ends, not only in the planting industry but in running a nightclub for many years during the off-season.

[rednekhippy]

Modafinil , Armodafinil and Caffeine + Aniracetam, Oxiracetam and Choline for a mental edge, low doses of oral steroids like oxandrolone to keep you jacked and GHB before bed to stimulate endogenous growth hormone secretion to speed recovery and healing

Is that a joke? Do you walk away with any money at the end of the day after buying all that shit?

If im dragging my feet I eat by 3pm I treat myself to a chocolate bar.. Maybe im underthinking it..

no joke, if you ever wondered how someone plants 20000 trees a shift consistently, now you know... not recomended for chocolate eating slowballers though

[salad_shooter]

Modafinil , Armodafinil and Caffeine + Aniracetam, Oxiracetam and Choline for a mental edge, low doses of oral steroids like oxandrolone to keep you jacked and GHB before bed to stimulate endogenous growth hormone secretion to speed recovery and healing

Is that a joke? Do you walk away with any money at the end of the day after buying all that shit?

If im dragging my feet I eat by 3pm I treat myself to a chocolate bar.. Maybe im underthinking it..

no joke, if you ever wondered how someone plants 20000 trees a shift consistently, now you know... not recomended for chocolate eating slowballers though

WOW! Have fun with organ failure, I hear living in the hospital is great...

[krahn]

i'm not saying that there aren't beneficial stimulants one could take, but you can definitely plant 20000 trees a shift without them. at least some can, and i suspect most could with the proper training and preparation.

the problem is that the body and especially the brain is so intricately wired that too often we find out too late what the consequences are to messing with the balance. ancient hunting gathering men and women were healthier than we are, and could live into their hundreds on occasion as well. although with smilodons to watch out for they may have traded in relaxation for constant stress, and stress is a killer too, so maybe centenarians were rare.

and about sleep deprivation... more and more we're finding out how important sleep is to memory. yes we can become more efficient with our sleep and possibly run on 5-6 hours a night, but especially if you're going 5 or less and cutting out certain steps, the time when you're taking what you learned the previous day and forming long-term memories, well then you just won't learn as well. they've studied this extensively with students, cramming for tests. if you stay up all night studying you perform poorly, in comparison. sometimes a lack of sleep is unavoidable, and if you're not performing new tasks then it might be fine on occasion, but keep in mind that if you're learning new planting techniques you want to get 7-8 hours to make sure it sticks.

[_pew_pew]

Some friends swear by kratom for long bike rides, etc. Might be worth a try.

[theBushman]

Ah, kratom. Eat a little 5x extract. The leaves suck to drag around, and extracts are a PITA to smoke, hard to light, huge crusty ashes.