Taxes for Treeplanters - You & the Canada Revenue Agency

[Sara]

[Edit by Administrator: I just combined five different topics about taxes, RWA, and deducting employment expenses into this one giant topic. So if the conversation seems to occasionally lack a bit of "flow," or if questions come up that were brought up earlier in the topic, that's why. But at least all the different discussions are in one place. You can probably tell which topic each post originated in by the title of the post].


So I know this topic always comes up but... can you claim camp costs as an employment expence?

[Tupperfan]

If you get remote camp site allowances, which reduce the taxable portion of your paycheck, it's supposed to cover for camp costs.

But you can ask your treeplanting company for T2200, which allows you to claim some other expanses, including equipment...

[Shelley]

You can also claim moving expenses if you "move" to your planting company and then back home. Two sets of moving expenses... start and end of season hotels, food, and plane tickets

It is all legal as long as you earn more money from the move then you claim (to prevent people from claiming vacations). Although be sure to keep all receipts around these dates in case you get audited.

[Scooter]

Be careful ... there are two completely different subjects being discussed here.

RWA, Remote Work Allowance, is one topic. I think there's an extensive discussion about it somewhere else here in the forums.

Moving Expenses are a different topic. As Shelley identified, you can claim Moving Expenses each time that you move a significant distance to go to a new job. The key thing is that you have to move at least 40 kilometers or something like that (if memory serves me correctly), and more importantly, you have to have more income at the new job after the move than you claimed for moving expenses.

For example, when I moved from New Brunswick to Prince George at the start of each planting season, I claimed my expenses on the move, which included transportation expenses, plus food and motels on the trip. I had to make more money during the planting season than I claimed, but that wasn't hard, because I usually only claimed fuel or an airplane ticket, plus a few meals and hotels, which came to less than $1000. Also, one other important thing is that you have to take up residence in the area to which you move (ie. I had to actually have a residence in PG to be eligible).

At the end of the summer, I would do the reverse - a move from Prince George to New Brunswick. Again, I had to make more money at my new job in New Brunswick than I claimed on the move, but then again, my moving expenses were generally less than $1000, so that was easy.

Had I been a university student without a job in New Brunswick, I could not have claimed the moving expenses on the way back, because I wasn't moving to a job, with one exception. If I had scholarships at university, I could claim moving expenses up to the value of my scholarships, because when it comes to moving expenses, scholarships are deemed to be equivalent to earned income.

I have done this for the past fifteen years, and have been audited a couple times, and I never had problems with my moving expenses. Note, of course, that you need to keep all your receipts to be able to verify your claim.


Getting back to Remote Work Allowance, that is something that happens while you are employed. So in other words, there is a big distinction between the two expense categories. Moving Expenses occur during the period when you're relocating to your new job. RWA, if you are eligible, happens only while you're working at that job.

[Jroot]

Here's another question that i've wondered about, can you deduct your equipment as an expense? Bags, shovel, tent, sleeping bag, etc.. I've heard all sorts of stories saying you can claim everything from moving expenses to camp costs, motels on days off, meals on days off... I've got to find out once and for all which can be used.

The link here has to deal with employment expenses :

http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/tax/individual ... enu-e.html
"You can deduct certain expenses you paid to earn employment income. You can do this only if your employment contract required you to pay the expenses, and either you did not receive an allowance for them, or the allowance you received is included in your income.
Note
Most employees cannot claim employment expenses. You cannot deduct the cost of travel to and from work, or other expenses, such as most tools and clothing."

That wording there is a bit tricky, so what exactly can we deduct if anything? The bags and shovel are only used for planting, so is that allright? What about a tent and sleeping bag? That could be potentially used for other things. What if we collect RWA or use that t2200? How do those apply? Does that nix any deductions we could possibly get? There's a form there for lodging and expenses, but it only seems to pertain to transportation workers. There's also a link there for forestry workers, but it only mentions a power saw as a deductible expense.

Anyone tried this, or any accountantreeplanters out there know about this?

[The Rev]

My understanding is that if you get RWA, you are not eligible to also claim employment expenses (T2200).

Trying for to claim both could = trouble with CRA...

[Mnky]

Rev... that is correct you can only claim one or the other...

if your company gives you an RWA then they will not give you a T2200

[Scooter]

Ok, Remote Work Allowance (RWA) is a question which is probably one of the biggest gray areas in tree planting and tax evasion. I'm going to post an email here that I got about a year and a half ago, and after talking to dozens of people about this subject, I STILL haven't gotten a great answer. I brought this up quite a while ago, but there's no point in ceasing to beat a dead horse. Maybe some fresh new eyes will be able to contribute useful info to this discussion:

Just finished my second season with XXX. I was curious how the RWA system works and discovered your post as the only place on the entirety of the internet ( that i could find ) information about how this payment scheme works.

I have a basic question that shouldnt be to hard to answer involved with your description , either i couldnt gather it from your very well posted response , or Im being shafted out of a couple thousand dollars.

When confronting my supervisor about how RWA works , I was told that is the amount of NON-taxable earnings from my gross earnings. Is this corrected , or am i owed the total of my RWA ? How does this get treated in a taxation sense?

Really, the whole issue should not be constrained to the very limited scope of this question. The crux of the matter is how RWA works and is applied, not the specific question at the end of this post. I would appreciate if anyone having ANY insight into RWA can contribute to this post, whether you're a planter who has/hasn't gotten it, if you're in management and have researched the issue, if you're an accountant, or if you work for Revenue Canada. ALL information will be appreciated. If you've worked for companies that have issued RWA, how do they do it? How can other planters benefit from this info?

[Sayward]

Here is the link to the form. http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/E/pbg/tf/td4/README.html

I don't know how the amount per day is determined, but the way it works is fairly simple. At my company, the RWA deduction is around $100/d. So, if you plant and your earnings for the day are $425, the RWA amount would be deducted (along with camp costs), and then your gross earnings for the day show up as $300. Basically, between the RWA and camp cost deductions, 25% of your income vanishes before you hit federal and provincial taxes.

This proved to be tricky though, when people I knew went to apply for mortgages and loans...

[Scooter]

Here's another email that I just received:

Scooter,

From what I can tell… this is my summary on RWA and what it is all about. In order to understand it properly you have to enter into a discussion about taxable benefits. A taxable benefit is something like if a company lets you have a company car. It is a type of salary and the government expects it to be taxed, as I am sure you are aware ( however I have my doubts that planters are aware that things like this are taxed).

Likewise if your employer provides room and board there is an associated taxable benefit. From what I can understand from the CRA website

” If you give free board, lodging, or both to an employee, the employee receives a taxable benefit. As a result, you must add to the employee's remuneration the fair market value of the meals and accommodation you provide. Report this amount in box 14, "Employment income", and in the "Other information" area under code 30 at the bottom of the employee's T4 slip.

If you provide subsidized board and lodging to an employee, determine the value of the benefit's board portion as described in "Subsidized meals". The benefit's lodging part is the fair market value of the accommodation minus any amount the employee paid. Report the benefits in box 14, "Employment income," and in the "Other information" area under code 30 at the bottom of the employee's T4 slip.”



So the remote work allowance, seems to be that employees in special situations, like remote work site, are exempt from this taxable benefit.



“Board, lodging, and transportation at special work sites and remote work locations
An individual can meet the requirements of both a remote work location and a special work site. However, the benefit can only be excluded from income once.

Special work sites
Generally, a special work site is an area where temporary duties are performed by an employee who maintains a self-contained domestic establishment at another location as his or her principal place of residence. Because of the distance between the two areas, the employee is not expected to return daily from the work site to his or her principal place of residence.

Usually, GST/HST applies on meals and accommodations you provide to an employee. In certain cases, such as long-term residential accommodation of one month or more, no GST/HST applies. Where GST/HST applies, include it in the value of the benefit.

Board and lodging

You can exclude from income the value of board and lodging that you provided to an employee who works at a special work site or the reasonable allowance the employee received if he or she worked away from home and all of the following conditions were met:

a. the employee must have worked at a special work site where the duties performed were of a temporary nature;

b. the employee maintained at another location a self-contained domestic establishment as his or her principal place of residence:

o that, throughout the period, was available for the employee's occupancy, and the employee did not rent it to any other person; and

o to which, because of distance, we could not reasonably expect the employee to have returned daily from the special work site; and

c. the board and lodging you provided or the reasonable allowance the employee received must have been for a period of at least 36 hours. This period can include time spent travelling between the employee's principal place of residence and a special work site. Also, the employee's duties required him or her to be away from the employee's principal place of residence or to be at the special work site.

Transportation

An employee can exclude from income the value of free or subsidized transportation between the special work site and the employee's principal place of residence, or a reasonable allowance received for his or her transportation expenses, for a period described in c). This only applies if the employee received board and lodging, or a reasonable allowance for board and lodging, from you for that period.

Form TD4, Declaration of Exemption - Employment at Special Work Site

If an employee meets all of the conditions in a), b), and c), you and the employee should complete Form TD4, Declaration of Exemption - Employment at Special Work Site. This allows you to exclude the benefit or allowance from the employee's income. If you complete Form TD4, do not include the amounts in box 14, "Employment income," or in the "Other information" area under code 30 at the bottom of the employee's T4 slip. After you complete Form TD4 with the employee, keep it with your payroll records.

If the employee does not meet all of the above conditions, do not complete Form TD4. Treat the amounts as part of the employee's income. Make the necessary deductions and report the amounts on the employee's T4 slip. This also applies to any part of an allowance for meals, accommodation, and transportation that is more than a reasonable amount.

Note
If the special work site is in a prescribed zone, see "Board, lodging, and transportation at a special work site".

Remote work locations
We usually consider a work location to be remote when it is 80 kilometres or more from the nearest established community with a population of at least 1,000 people.

A location is not considered an established community if it lacks essential services or such services are not available within a reasonable commuting distance (such as basic food store, basic clothing store with merchandise in stock [not a mail-order outlet], access to housing, certain medical help, and certain educational facilities).



Board and lodging

You can exclude from income the value of board and lodging that you provide to an employee who works at a remote work location, or the allowance the employee receives, if the following conditions are met:

the employee could not reasonably be expected to set up and maintain a self-contained domestic establishment because of the remoteness of the location and the distance from any established community;
you have not provided a self-contained establishment for the employee; and
the reasonable allowances were for a period of at least 36 hours when:
the employee's duties required the employee to be away from the principal place of residence; or
the employee had to be at the remote work location.
Transportation

You can exclude from income the value of free or subsidized transportation. A reasonable allowance for transportation expenses may also be excluded.

To qualify, the transportation allowance paid to an employee must be for a period of at least 36 hours when:

the employee had to be away from his or her principal place of residence; or
the employee had to be at the remote work location.
You must have paid the allowance for transportation between the remote work location and any location in Canada. If the remote work location is outside Canada, the allowance for transportation between that location and any location in Canada, or another location also outside Canada, qualifies.

We do not need Form TD4, Declaration of Exemption - Employment at Special Work Site, when there is an exemption for board, lodging, or transportation allowances you pay to employees who work at a remote work location. If you need help determining whether a location qualifies as remote, contact any tax services office or tax centre.

When you provide board, lodging, and transportation under the above conditions, you do not have to report the equivalent value or any GST/HST that applies as remuneration to the employee on the T4 slip.

Payroll deductions

If you exclude a benefit for board, lodging, and transportation at a special work site or remote work location, it is not pensionable and not insurable. Do not deduct CPP contributions, EI premiums, or income tax. “

http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/E/pub/tg/t4130 ... P454_38194


that is all I could find on the website.

[TheHamsterizer]

Well that pretty much explains it... On a slightly unrelated note, did you guys know that you could withdraw all of your cpp contributions at any time? I just found that out. I don't think I'll do it, but it's nice that the option is always there.

[krahn]

you serious hamsterizer? can't find any info on it yet but i trust you, not sure i'd take it out but i'm curious how much is in the pot.

[krahn]

http://www.mathisen.ca/commentary/nov2005.htm#2

that's all i've found, and that makes it sound like 60 is the earliest age you can touch it. where did you hear otherwise?

[Scooter]

That would be interesting if it was possible. I'd love to take it out and put the money somewhere else. Of course, I'd probably get taxed on it if I took it out now, but it would probably be worth it. It's not like the country is going to have any money to cover my retirement stream by the time I'm old enough to retire.

[TheHamsterizer]

http://www.mathisen.ca/commentary/nov2005.htm#2

that's all i've found, and that makes it sound like 60 is the earliest age you can touch it. where did you hear otherwise?

Yeah, it turns out you might have to be 60. I was just poking around on my ei page and it shows you the breakdown of what you've put in, and there's an option to withdraw it. It's on that e-pass thing.

[McgeeMcgee]

Travelling? Motels and food on day off? Equipment? I have never really understood what you can claim during the season. Just curious what others are doing.

[Brandini]

I've claimed relocation costs such as vehicle kms at the governments standard rate (58cents per km???) you don't need a receipt for that. If you keep receipts you can also do meals and accommodations during your relocation.

[Scooter]

By relocation do you mean "moving expenses"?

[jules]

Scooter - as far as I know, you're allowed to claim relocation costs for work or school on your taxes. I claim traveling expenses (Greyhound tickets, etc.) and work-specific gear (like caulks, rain gear, planting shovels and bags) every year. I doubt you could get away with claiming day off motels and food, or clothing, though. And I've never had to worry about vehicle mileage.

But basically, if you're super worried about it, go get your taxes done, and bring the receipts you're concerned about with you.

[Scooter]

No, I'm pretty comfortable with the whole process. I studied tax accounting at university.


Essentially, I claim two things: Moving Expenses (twice per year) for the moves to and from BC and New Brunswick, jumping back and forth between jobs. And our company uses the T2200 approach instead of RWA, which seems to be more bulletproof for our situation. The T2200 is a form to accompany a claim for hotels on days off, food, equipment, etc.

Some companies, instead of issuing a T2200, take the RWA approach. I'm not too familiar with that, because we looked into it at Folklore and we were told that RWA was not appropriate for our camps.

[Brandini]

Yes moving expenses, from one job to another. And certain rules from summer work to school.

Claiming moving expenses:
http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/E/pbg/tf/t1-m/t1-m-11e.pdf

Per kilometer Rate based on your province. Also describes the simplified method which I use.
http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/travelcosts/

[fluffer]

The RWA knocks off a bunch of your pay from taxable income.... something like 25%... so in the end your t4/employment history shows you earned 7500 instead of 10,000. It's like you get 2500 under the table and tax free. So if you paid CPP or taxes on it then you will get a refund. If you have to go on EI then it might bite you in the ass.

[dkarvas]

Just to confirm, did anyone have luck claiming equipment (shovel, boots, bags) for tax returns? I'm a new rookie starting out and I'm wondering if I should buy new at a store (and potentially get the money back in tax returns) or buy used equipment over Craigslist. I believe I'm in Scooter's camp, which uses the T2200.

edit: Also, how far can you go with claiming that something is work related? Jules a couple posts up said that rain gear was classified as work equipment, but in reality, that judgment is very subjective. Is there a limit to how much you can claim, since I could hypothetically buy the most expensive rain gear I could find and claim that it's needed it for work?

[Scooter]

A couple thoughts, although some of these are grey areas, ie. if you get audited, the validity of what you do would sometimes depend on the mood of the auditor:
- I've only ever claimed equipment that is directly identifiable with planting, ie. planting gear. Rain gear might be pushing it.
- You could buy used and ask the seller to give you a handwritten receipt, so you'd still be able to claim the expense.
- You won't save a lot of money by buying used. Maybe save $50 on a full set of gear? If you save more, it's probably because the gear is old. I think you're better off getting new gear, so you know all the straps and buckles on the bags are in good shape. The padding on pads becomes less effective after a couple of seasons, so you might end up wanting to buy new waist pads or shoulder straps if you find the ones on old gear are getting uncomfortable, which would negate any cost savings. I'm a fan of the concept that after you've used your bags for two or three seasons, you should try putting them on and then try putting a new pair on in a store, and considering if the new pair is a lot more comfortable. You're wearing these bags 8 or 9 hours a day, and you want them to be as comfortable as possible. Spending a few extra dollars on a new set is probably worth it, if it means your body is a lot more comfortable for the next three months.

[dkarvas]

http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/E/pub/tg/t4044 ... l#chapter3

Under supplies, it states that:

You cannot deduct the cost of special clothing you wear or have to wear for your work. Also, you cannot deduct the cost of any tools that are considered to be equipment. However, if you are a tradesperson (including an apprentice mechanic) as described in Chapter 7, you may be able to deduct the cost of eligible tools you bought to earn employment income as a tradesperson.

As far as I know, tree planting is not considered a trade...though I could be wrong

[Scooter]

I'll try to find out more this afternoon.

[Screefhead]

I claim camp costs, vehicle expenses ( gas, maintenance, insurance ..etc), hotels and food . Although, if your claimed expenses exceed a certain percentage of your gross income you will probably get audited.

If you get RWA you are not allowed to claim work expenses AFAIK. Getting RWA is far preferable than having to deal with the hassles of claiming work expenses . Most good - considerate contractors will do the RWA for their planters.

For some reason companies that plant in Alberta will not do RWA, but will grudgingly provide a T2200.

[Scooter]

Dkarvas, I just talked to our office about putting together an info package that we can distribute to all planters before the season starts. I usually talk about this at our first meeting with everyone, the day before the season starts, but I want to be able to email this info to everyone in mid-April.

I've learned a lot about RWA and T2200's just recently (certainly more than I understood in past seasons). The problem with RWA's is that an employee must be able to prove that they maintain a residence elsewhere during the planting season. Many coastal planters are able to do this. However, at any company that employs a number of university students, there is a problem. University students are often ineligible for RWA, because if you live in a university residence, you're not paying for the residence during the summer. If you have an apartment on an 8-month lease, you're not eligible. If you're on a 12-month lease but you sublet your place during the summer, you may not be eligible (this is a grey area). If you claim to live at your parents during the planting season, you're not eligible. Even for coastal planters, if you live out of a van, you're going to have pretty much no luck proving your eligibility to an auditor. Because of this, companies need to decide which system to use: RWA or T2200's. From a liability point-of-view, it probably makes sense for coastal companies to use RWA in most instances, and for most other companies to use T2200's (but that depends entirely on each company's workforce). The drawback of issuing RWA to ineligible employees is that it could cause a whole lot of headaches down the road, both for the company and for all employees.

For some reason companies that plant in Alberta will not do RWA, but will grudgingly provide a T2200.

I don't think this is accurate. There is absolutely no reason for a company to resist issuing a T2200. It takes only a couple minutes per person to prepare. Ultimately, it means that the employee is going to have higher net earnings for the summer (long-term, after taxes), so it is in the company's best interests to issue T2200's. I've used the T2200's for around ten years, I would guess, without a problem.

As far as what's covered, I think it is, "Camping and Planting Equipment, Camp Costs, and Food & Lodging on Days Off." I'm still trying to make sure this is accurate. I believe that most planting contractors who use RWA limit their RWA amounts to under 20% of gross, because (I think) a claim of over 20% leads to an automatic audit. So for an employee earning $15,000 in a couple months, you're looking at an exemption of around $3000 on RWA. If you go the T2200 route, you're looking at about the same total for most people once camp costs and basic equipment and day-off expenses are totalled (I believe that food is assessed at 50% of face value, not 100%). I think that if you're audited, the headaches are similar but different. With T2200's, you'd have to show all your receipts from the things you spent money on. With RWA, you'd have to show receipts to prove that you maintained a residence. For someone who is renting officially from a landlord who isn't taking cash, it's easy because you have your monthly rent cheques. If you're a homeowner, you'd have to collect all the bills in your name for items such as power, water/sewer, insurance, etc. (if the bills are being paid by a spouse, you might have a problem).

Like many other things associated with taxes and the Canada Revenue Agency, some of these areas are grey. Your best bet, if you're trying to make sure you're doing things 100% legitimately, is to contact the CRA themselves for advice.

[Screefhead]

Its been my experience working for various Alberta companies that if want a T2200 you'll have to pester the company to get it. Its not that they're opposed to giving out the forms, many just dont want to do the work preparing them.

The reasons for not giving RWA dont seem to make sense either. It still doesn't explain why RWA isnt given out in Alberta but often is in BC. Probably 1/2 of the planters at the BC company I was at last year were university students . Despite that, the employer didn't seem to have any concerns doing RWA. Are the RWA rules different for BC vs AB?

[Nate]

I think planting companies wouldn't want planters to start going for the T2200s because the company would get audited hard if they had a deluge of them submitted in one year to the CRA. This happened to a survey company I worked for that would be about the same size as your average planting company and the CRA put the smack down on the company because of the attention their T2200s attracted. One guy who figured out how to make the T2200 really work on taxes shared the tip with a bunch of the other guys, and the company went from 0 submitted over the past few years to nearly two dozen in that year.

Then all company use of work trucks outside of work became a taxable benefit that was strictly monitored, all private purchases related to work had to be confirmed by the office, etc. etc.

[Slowsis]

The reasons for not giving RWA dont seem to make sense either. It still doesn't explain why RWA isnt given out in Alberta but often is in BC. Probably 1/2 of the planters at the BC company I was at last year were university students . Despite that, the employer didn't seem to have any concerns doing RWA. Are the RWA rules different for BC vs AB?

I've worked in AB using RWA a number of times. Not sure if there are different regulations, but its definitely possible to have RWA in Alberta.

[Nate]

I have a friend working for the CRA now who was originally involved with planting for several years. I'll see if I can get some more accurate information from her without raising a bunch of flags, although it will be late April before I'd be able to do that.

I kind of feel like this is one of those scenarios that really depends on the flags a particular person/company's file raises and what the interpretation of the CRA auditor who reviews it is. I'd be really surprised if the CRA had thought about this one in relation to Silviculture or if their policies were standardized enough that their response could be predicted. Would be interesting to hear what your friend thinks.

[Mike]

If you claim to live at your parents during the planting season, you're not eligible.

Unless you are paying rent to your parents and can produce rent receipts.

[Scooter]

True. I bet it wouldn't take longer than about twenty minutes before they got audited too, to ensure that they claimed that rental income.

[Mike]

Indeed.

[Shanti]

I haven't had to use the T2200 for quite a while, been doing the RWA thing, which for me has always worked better. Anyways, have a couple of questions for those of you who do file this way. Do you fill out a t777 and put camp costs and motel down as lodging, then just add meals as a food expense, and then put things like greyhound or plane tickets, down in the unspecified box and call it transport??? I think the only other time I had to do my taxes this way, I just added it all up and put it on line 229. Revenue Canada told me that is defintely not the way to go, and that I have to do a t777. According to form t777 meals are only calculated at 50%. I had thought they where totally deductible. This doesn't even cover all those other things like tent, boots, bags, etc. Sort of don't want to put down equipment or tools, because the people at CRA where adamant that the only tool I could claim was a powersaw, and that nothing else was deductible.

[Chunk]

I haven't had to use the T2200 for quite a while, been doing the RWA thing, which for me has always worked better. Anyways, have a couple of questions for those of you who do file this way. Do you fill out a t777 and put camp costs and motel down as lodging, then just add meals as a food expense, and then put things like greyhound or plane tickets, down in the unspecified box and call it transport??? I think the only other time I had to do my taxes this way, I just added it all up and put it on line 229. Revenue Canada told me that is defintely not the way to go, and that I have to do a t777. According to form t777 meals are only calculated at 50%. I had thought they where totally deductible. This doesn't even cover all those other things like tent, boots, bags, etc. Sort of don't want to put down equipment or tools, because the people at CRA where adamant that the only tool I could claim was a powersaw, and that nothing else was deductible.

This is interesting.... I've never tried to claim any planting related expenses. I did a bit of research and it looks like you need your employer to sign off on a Form T2200 before you can fill out a T777. Is it legit to claim motel costs for days off? Bus/plane tickets for the trip home at the end of the season?

[SwampDonkey]

If you submit a GST390 form for work related purchases, be aware that the Harper government considers this years claim on that form as taxable income next year.

And if your staying in a camp and traveling from there to the work site, those travel costs can not be claimed either. I've read that more than once in the tax guides and tax software. As a matter of fact, we had a mill near here with folks traveling to and from work from their homes in company vehicles. The Feds did an audit, and all those workers owed the Feds $3500 including fines. And this was 4 years after the mill had gone bankrupt, but was bought by another company. They'll track the little guy down, don't think otherwise.

As a thinner or even a logger with a saw, we can claim things like safety boots. But I don't think you can claim any garments unless they are for safety, like cutter pants.

[Shanti]

Yeah,
I know about the part of going from camp to the worksite. I was under the impression that the greyhound ticket from my town to the rendezvous point was deductible, and am pretty sure it is ok to claim camp costs as lodging at 100% rather than as food where it looks like they would only be counted as 50%. I think all this goes on the t777. It is just after talking to CRA, the first person confirmed this and the second one told me none of it could be claimed regardless of what was on my T2200. I think I will definitely be giving preferences to employers who provide RWA on their contracts.

[SwampDonkey]

Well I'm not sure if you can claim 100 % of camp cost either. Pretty sure the government has a formula. They realize that living at home costs money to, so ipso fatso.

[fluffer]

How do people calculate these?

http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/tx/ndvdls/tpcs ... s-eng.html

The simplified method for meals just says to claim 51$/day for each day travelling.

If travelling is done by commercial transit, ie plane or bus, it seems clear to deduct the cost of the travel on top of the meal claims.

But what about if you drive your vehicle?

Say I drive from NS to BC and then back again to NS to start post-season work.

That is roughly 12000km, including moves during the season. The rate to claim per km for all legs is .51/km. So, am I to understand that if I do this particular drive (alone) and it takes me ~4 days each direction then I would be able to claim 408$ (51*8) for meals and 6120$ for travel?

If there were 3 people sharing a vehicle, would it be legitimate to split the vehicle expense claim?

[Aeryk]

It is my understanding that you have to actually take up residence in the place you moved to. I have seen a few posts by Scooter mentioning this on here. So I believe that it would be impossible to claim travel expenses for most people. Maybe scooter can chime in on this detail and how he does this if he is reading?

[Scooter]

I'll try to answer all of this in better detail in a week, but right now I'm about to move across the country for coastal work so time is tight.

Short answers:
- The per diam rates are new to me.
- I always just kept actual receipts when I was doing the drive and claimed exact amounts. Not very helpful when you shoot from PG to Halifax in 58 hours drinking a flat of diet coke and eating sunflower seeds.
- Sharing vehicle with others ... you'd want to total up all the expenses, have receipts for proof, document it all and split it three ways, and then photocopy for the other two so they also had proof. However, I'm not sure if even that would be permitted. It may be that the registered vehicle owner would be the only one allowed to claim the vehicle portion. In that case, contributions by the other two would have to be treated by the owner of the vehicle as other income, sort of like running a taxi.
- Moving expenses have some limitations. You have to take up residence in the new place, ie. have a place that you can "call" your home (and probably show receipts for rental). And you also have to have receipts to confirm that you were living in the old place, so if you can't prove that you lived at your parents, that might cause some concern. But you might be able to confirm it by showing T4's or pay stubs, and saying that you just didn't pay rent at your old place. I can't remember the specifics, and I haven't done my own taxes yet this year to jog my memory.

[chopsticks]

I don't believe you have to take up permanent residence where your new job will be, especially if you will be living on the job site ie: camp. For instance, I bought a car in Vancouver after last season and drove to Montreal and worked a few jobs to make some walking around money. Because I went that whole distance to a new job, I was able to deduct (based on the 51c/km + food per diem + hotels/hostels/etc formula) against income in made in Montreal. Driving back to BC, I get to do the same thing. Each time I did it solo, so I'm not sure about the cost splitting.

[fluffer]

I read through the online info and it seems that students can clearly can claim these moving expenses.

Not sure about the situation many planters find themselves in when they ditch their address to move to BC for the planting season. Since I have no permanently dwelling and I unload my lease before the season then it seems that I am moving for work. It seems like a grey area.

[Aeryk]

I have not done this myself but from the forms (T1-M I believe) it would seem that you do need to take up a new residence. If someone has done this before without having actually taken up residence please explain in detail how it is done because it seems to be a serious area of confusion and interest round these parts.

[fluffer]

It seems that students should feel entirely comfortable claiming this. It says students are able to claim for moving expenses from school at end of year for job purposes. Then says they can claim for the costs of returning to school. That implies that, at least in the case of students, establishing a new residence can be as short as a few months. Since the lives of workers whose jobs are not groundedin 9-5 m-f work or regular 14 on 7 off shifts often reflect the frequent establishment of new residences (which are as permanent as they may get for many planters) I fail to see where moving to BC for 4 months would be excluded as a change of residence assuming it becomes your new permanent (however temporary permanent is) place of dwelling.

Claiming this would likely offset all travel costs, taking up to a grand off the tax bill of most planters (is it just a federal tax deduction or can be used against provincial taxes as well?). It seems like a grey area, where fully claiming it is too generous and not claiming it disadvantages the planter compared to other workers who would qualify. So somewhere in between would seem most in line and fair. But I guess we're only offered a fairly black and white scenario. I am inclined to assume the matter of debate and technicalities fall in my interest. I think that is the precedent set by our current federal government so I assume it is equally acceptable for the average canadian?

[Scooter]

I still haven't had time to look into this, but I seem to recall that Moving Expenses are only eligible to the point where they can be offset against income earned in the new location.

So for example, if you're from Nova Scotia and you "move" out west (ignoring the issues of what is legitimate residency) for the summer and make a schwack of money as a planter, then move back to Nova Scotia in September for school, you should easily be able to claim Moving Expenses (again, ignoring the issue of residency) for the move out west because you made lots of income as a planter that exceeded the cost of moving.

However, your move back to school might be less likely to be useful. A scholarship counts as earned income. And wages count as earned income. So if you have a scholarship or a part-time job, and the money received from those sources exceeds the cost of the move, then you're going to be able to claim the entire amount of Moving Expenses. If you make some money from scholarships and/or part-time jobs, but not as much as your Moving Expenses, you can claim the amount of Moving Expenses up to the amount of money that you received. If you did not make any money in the new location from scholarships and/or work, then you can't claim any of that move back to school. To further complicate matters, it's figured out based on a calendar year. So if you moved back east in December (for school in January) and didn't work or earn any money until you started a part-time job in the middle of January, I believe you have to file the Moving Expenses paperwork in the first year, but cannot claim the expense until the following year in which the money was earned.

It's a bit complicated when you're talking about low income in your destination, or moves near the end of a calendar year.

And that still doesn't address the issue where I think you need to be able to prove residency in each of the two locations (although I do believe there is a little bit of flexibility there).

[Aeryk]

I suppose where i always get confused on this issue is the fact that you need to set up a new residence. Does a bush camp qualify as this? What would you put as the address for such a camp? can u claim for moves from camp to camp? for example this year my company is based near my residence but we will be working almost a 800km away from my home. Can I claim the move from my previous camp/motel hear on the island to the camp/motel in the interior. If i do do this and get audited i have no reciepts from a landlord or bills of sales of a new home to prove my new residency at these locations....by the wording on the tax forms it would appear I would be getting a good screwing by the tax man if it came down to it.

[bluejay]

I spent an hour on the phone with CRA and they told me my best option was to speak with the small business professionals. The establishment of a permanent residence is required to claim moving expenses so they told me moving to a tent meant I was not allowed to make this claim, even if I spent 264 days living in said tent.

The agent told me I could still make the claim then argue the move with the person who would be auditing my return. The cost of losing

The entire argument the professional I spoke with used is bolded below. She says If I planned on returning to my old residence I would not qualify for moving expenses.

You must establish your new home as the place where you ordinarily reside. For example, you have established a new home if you have sold or rented (or advertised for sale or rent) your old home.

Here is the T1M moving expenses claim form.

http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/E/pbg/tf/t1-m/t1-m-13e.pdf

1st offence: free pass
2nd offence: $100 and 50% of the understand tax/overstated credits related to false statement

Losing an audit means you need to repay the amount credited to you when you get your tax money back at 1% per month compounded monthly (~12.7% a year).

This whole thing is over my head and I've never actually made this claim. I'm being told by the agent to just make the claim, and risk the audit since I am only afraid of the moving expenses line. Sadly the agent could not tell me what steps I could take that would make my claim more legitimate. Getting your employer to write you a letter saying they didn't reimburse you for moving expenses may be requested from you.

They will likely send you a letter asking for information relating to the move. If this information is not accepted then the agents will begin the reassessment of your tax return. Then they will charge you all the taxes you were supposed to pay plus interest. They will then read out the riot act saying do this exact same thing again and you will be hit with escalating fines.