2024 Public Bid Results

This forum is used to collect the results of some of the most popular threads, the annual bid results.
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

The PG job is a very tough job. I can see why people aren't interested.

On that note, I received this useful info from a valued contributor (thanks!) re. the average number of bids submitted on each contract. This is "to date" in the sense that it's all of the public results posted earlier in this topic, but doesn't include the next couple of jobs that I'm about to post.

---

A quick look at bid results for the last 3 years (2024 to date):
2022 - 279 bidders on 44 jobs = 6.34 per job
2023 - 300 bidders on 48 jobs = 6.25 per job
2024 - 109 bidders on 24 jobs = 4.54 per job
---

What does this mean? On the surface, when there are fewer bids, the odds of any individual company winning a contract go up. This is pretty obvious. For example, if six companies bid on a job and each submits a random bid with no knowledge of the ground, the odds of a specific company in that group having the lowest bid are 1 in 6 or about 16.7%. If there are only three bidders, then the odds go up to 1 in 3 or 33.3%.

The real-world relationship is more complex, because each company should [hopefully] have some knowledge of the difficulty of the contract, which would influence their bid price and chance of winning the bid. But while there is no longer an equal chance of winning a bid, the relationship between the number of bidders vs the odds of winning a bid is still inversely propotional - fewer bidders, better chances.

However, there is a positive feedback mechanism at work here too, which we can call the invisible hand of the market. When bidders see that there are fewer entities bidding, some of them become less aggressive in their bids. They know the chance of winning is higher, so they don't have to be so competitive. Some will do up a bid and then raise their prices arbitrarily. Others will be more likely to put in a "blind bid" (a bid based upon an office analysis of the contract specs and maps that is not supported by a thorough field reccie). Also, some companies will be more likely to put in a "lottery bid" where they know that their price is not competitive, on the small chance that nobody else bids, or that all other submitted bids are other lottery bids higher than their own.

There have been some contracts already this year where only a single bidder submitted a bid. What happens in this case? Well, the government has to look at the price and decide what to do. Technically, the government can re-tender if they don't believe that the sole bid was a fair market price and if they believe that by re-tendering, they can attract new bids (or a lower bid by the original bidder). This is unfortunate if you look at such a case from the perspective of a planting company, but it's good if you look at this from the prospective of a tax-paying resident of British Columbia (since the government is responsible for the public purse). Of course, the government can also decide that re-tendering the contract might not attract additional bidders, and can even backfire, because if the company that was the sole bidder the first time realizes nobody else was interested, they might RAISE their price on the second go-round. Of course it's important to note that when there's a single bidder on a job, the government won't release the unofficial bid results on that job until they're certain that they're not going to re-tender, because that would send a price signal to the market.

Anyway, the number of people bidding on each project this Fall is decreasing, and this is good for planting companies. It has a bit of a disproportionate indirect inverse multiplier effect, which is good for the industry. Public bids are being won at stronger prices than a year ago, which leads to rippling effects. Even though public work only accounts for roughly 20% of the trees in BC, the public bids act as a barometer for the private sector. Foresters at private mills are taking note of the way that the market is trending.
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

Here are the results for a contract for Planting in the Cariboo

Contract: PL25FOR001
Client: Forsite/MOF
# of Trees: 1,203,249
Season: Spring 2023
Opened: November 17th, 2023
Contractor Rating System: N/A
Left on the Table: 20.4%

The general location of this group of blocks is the DMH Elephant Hill Fire, off the Mound, Chasm, and Mount Grant roads. Blocks range from an easy trenched block on the west side (which my own crew started in May 2023) to a challenging wildfire block on the far east side which was a semi-mature burn in which a lot of trees are fallen sideways but not down on the ground (so it will be hard to climb around in that block). I've attached a graphic showing the block locations (this contract is the green blocks).

This contract was originally an OTR from last year which did not have the mutual support from both parties, and was thus not renewed. Coast Range had this contract in its previous incarnation.

01. $ 703,124 - 58.4 cents/tree - Torrent
02. $ 846,542 - 70.4 cents/tree - Apex
03. $ 854,161 - 71.0 cents/tree - Folklore
04. $1,067,425 - 88.7 cents/tree - Fieldstone
Attachments
PL25FOR001 Block Locations.jpg
PL25FOR001 Block Locations.jpg (253.38 KiB) Viewed 126729 times
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

Here are the results for another contract for Planting in the Cariboo

Contract: PL25FOR002
Client: Forsite/MOF
# of Trees: 1,123,700
Season: Spring 2024
Opened: November 17th, 2023
Contractor Rating System: n/a
Left on the Table: 36.1%

This contract is a good case study for people who are trying to understand the nuances of bidding in BC. Without being a part of the bidding network (ie. viewing blocks and understanding how bids are structured), it's almost impossible to interpret bids properly. The dollar amount for the bid means almost nothing by itself, so you also need to have a good direct understanding of the underlying contract (specs and paper documentation, plus an accurate field reccie).

Up above, I talked about the diminishing number of bidders on each contract, and here's a perfect example of what can happen when there are fewer bids, and when some of those bids are not necessarily competitive. In this case, Folklore left a lot of money on the table. Unfortunate? Absolutely. Misjudged? No.

I'm extremely familiar with this contract. This was my own contract as an OTR (option to renew), and consists of wildfire burn blocks. My camp worked on this contract in 2023, and we were supposed to do it again in 2024. We had it priced at 66.3 cents in 2023, and once the helicopter costs were backed out (about 5.8 cents per tree for the 2023 job as a whole) we expected to plant it again in 2024 for 60.5 cents per tree. But the Ministry thought that our price was "too high" and did not renew. They obviously did not see the direction that the market was headed.

I looked at this contract very carefully in October, knowing [at the time] that it would be my own crews planting this renewable job. The difficulty level is the same as last year's work. And no helicopter is needed, although for unit OGMA 26 we'll need to cut an ATV access trail in from the west and south since there's a steep hill in the way blocking a direct approach to the block.

Anyway, as can be seen, there was no significant interest in this job from other bidders, just a couple of high flyer bids from Apex and Fieldstone. Had Folklore been able to know in advance that this would happen, they could have bid a lot higher and still won the job. So that sucks. But in the end, the price is what Folklore originally assessed as being the fair market value, based on the difficulty of the ground.

A good question to ask is why nobody else was seriously interested in this job. Two reasons come to mind. First, this isn't a great location for finding a camp site (and it's a very long drive for someone staying in motels out on highway 97). Second, a lot of companies have already filled up their schedules for 2024, and don't want to take the risk of taking on too much work. A lot of companies struggled to get their trees done in 2023.

The funny thing about this contract is that this is a perfect reversal of the MOF Mackenzie job, which was coincidentally also a Folklore job originally but which was also re-tendered. In that case, Apex won the job for 29 cents less than Folklore, although in Mackenzie, Apex was the only company that put in a serious competitive bid. Here's a link to that job, which was posted above: https://www.replant.ca/phpBB3/viewtopic ... 567#p93567

Attached is an overview map of this job (the pink blocks) which also shows the FOR003 job which I'm posting next. The blocks for this contract are out near the end of the Chasm FSR and on the Brigade FSR. The three red slashes indicate roads that are generally impassible in the spring. So the crews will come in from the west side of this map, up near the top of Loon Lake, not in from the Deadman-Vidette road just east of the blocks.

01. $680,739 - 60.6 cents/tree - Folklore
02. $926,897 - 82.5 cents/tree - Apex
03. $1,067,581 - 95.0 cents/tree - Fieldstone
Attachments
Contract Layout FOR 002&003.jpg
Contract Layout FOR 002&003.jpg (710.54 KiB) Viewed 126727 times
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

Here are the results for another contract for Planting in the Cariboo

Contract: PL25FOR003
Client: Forsite/MOF
# of Trees: 678,380
Season: Spring 2024
Opened: November 17th, 2023
Contractor Rating System: N/A
Left on the Table: 2.9%

In contrast to the previous job, there was more interest in this one, with three serious bids plus Apex and Fieldstone putting in high bids again. This is another contract of wildfire burns.

You can see the block on this contract (which are mostly on the Bridage FSR) highlighted in green on the map in the previous post.

This contract is a good match for the previous contract, and some of the blocks actually touch blocks for PL25FOR002. One camp can easily do both contracts.

01. $433,014 - 63.8 cents/tree - Folklore
02. $445,696 - 65.7 cents/tree - Evergreen
03. $450,239 - 66.4 cents/tree - Torrent
04. $542,174 - 79.9 cents/tree - Apex
05. $601,230 - 88.6 cents/tree - Fieldstone
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

Here are the results of a contract for Seedling Protector Removal

Contract: FH24TCB044
Client: BCTS Campbell River
Opened: November 22nd, 2023
Contractor Rating System: N/A
Left on the Table: 2.9%

This one may be of interest for people looking for work on the Island.

01. $ 48,635 - Osprey
02. $ 50,033 - Chris Murphy
03. $ 58,121 - Renewable Forest Services
04. $ 74,359 - 4C Forestry
05. $ 97,624 - Integrity Industrial (Jake)
06. $175,557 - Meridian Forest Services
07. $177,739 - Strategic
Attachments
FH24TCB044 Unverified Bid Results.jpg
FH24TCB044 Unverified Bid Results.jpg (170.02 KiB) Viewed 126718 times
FH24TCB044 Conditions-of-Tender.pdf
(177.4 KiB) Downloaded 135 times
FH24TCB044 Info-to-Bidders.pdf
(90.37 KiB) Downloaded 135 times
FH24TCB044 Tree_Protector_Packing_Storage_Instructions.pdf
(3.53 MiB) Downloaded 122 times
FH24TCB044 Tender-Offer-Form_Hard-Copy-Submission.pdf
(145.26 KiB) Downloaded 143 times
FH24TCB044 eAdvertisement.pdf
(1.22 MiB) Downloaded 105 times
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

Here are the results of a contract for Brushing in Golden

Contract: BR25TKR004
Client: BCTS Golden
Opened: November 22nd, 2023
Season: 2024
Contractor Rating System: N/A
Left on the Table: 16.2%

This is for 208.7 Ha of Brushing work.

01. $221,775 - Mihis
02. $257,800 - All Stars
03. $267,375 - Outland
04. $625,842 - Evergreen
Attachments
BR25TKR004 Unverified Bid Results.jpg
BR25TKR004 Unverified Bid Results.jpg (97.42 KiB) Viewed 126718 times
BR25TKR004 eAdvertisement.pdf
(723.67 KiB) Downloaded 137 times
BR25TKR004 Info_to_Bidders.pdf
(118.92 KiB) Downloaded 134 times
BR25TKR004 Conditons_of_Tender.pdf
(212.69 KiB) Downloaded 119 times
BR25TKR004 tender_offer_form_for_hard_copy_submission.pdf
(181.36 KiB) Downloaded 120 times
BR25TKR004 Schedule_A_Veg_Management.pdf
(729.09 KiB) Downloaded 137 times
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

Here are the results for a contract for Planting in Prince George

Contract: PL25TGC002
Client: BCTS Prince George
# of Trees: 198,900
Season: Summer 2024
Opened: November 22nd, 2023
Contractor Rating System: Yes
Left on the Table: N/A, one bidder

This is for work out in the Robson Valley.

EDIT:

I had to edit this post. We discovered a problem with BC Bid. Earlier today, only one bidder was showing (see the attached screen capture image showing just Whanau). However, now there are three bidders showing!

This is not the first time that this has happened this Fall. A few weeks ago, another contract showed only two bidders, with one company winning a job and leaving a LOT of money on the table. But then a few hours later, there were five bidders showing. In that case, it appeared that the second group of bids was added when BCTS discovered that only the hard-copy bids were considered at the time of opening, and then a short time later they discovered that the bids submitted digitally through BC Bid hadn't been considered, so those also had to be incorporated. It may be that the same thing happened with this bid.


01. $135,035 - 67.9 cents/tree - Free To Grow Contracting
01. $166,992 - 83.9 cents/tree - Whanau
03. $182,969 - 92.0 cents/tree - Future Roots Reforestation
Attachments
PL25TGC002 Unverified Later In Day.jpg
PL25TGC002 Unverified Later In Day.jpg (120.72 KiB) Viewed 126681 times
PL25TGC002 Unverified Bid Results.jpg
PL25TGC002 Unverified Bid Results.jpg (67.48 KiB) Viewed 126693 times
PL25TGC002 Schedule_C_-_Other_Conditins.pdf
(961.74 KiB) Downloaded 142 times
PL25TGC002 Conditions_of_Tender.pdf
(215.27 KiB) Downloaded 117 times
PL25TGC002 Information_to_Bidders (1).pdf
(200.36 KiB) Downloaded 131 times
PL25TGC002 Tender_Offer_Form_for_Hard_Copy_Submission.pdf
(296.94 KiB) Downloaded 134 times
PL25TGC002 eAdvertisement.pdf
(863.15 KiB) Downloaded 111 times
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Cyper »

Current numbers for bids for the 2024 planting season are staggering.

In comparison to the previous 2 years we have a huge increase.
Here are the average winning bids per contract for the last 3 years.
These are not weighted averages so a small job gets as much weight as a large one.

$.664 - 2024
$.517 - 2023
$.519 - 2022

The winning bids for 2024 are 28.4% higher than those for 2023
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

Great, thanks for this update. I'm going to try to put together a weighted-average analysis of all the bids in late January, but this is great info to know while the bidding season is still in progress.
$.664 - 2024
$.517 - 2023
$.519 - 2022
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

This is not the first time that this has happened this Fall. A few weeks ago, another contract showed only two bidders, with one company winning a job and leaving a LOT of money on the table. But then a few hours later, there were five bidders showing. In that case, it appeared that the second group of bids was added when BCTS discovered that only the hard-copy bids were considered at the time of opening, and then a short time later they discovered that the bids submitted digitally through BC Bid hadn't been considered, so those also had to be incorporated. It may be that the same thing happened with this bid.
Re. the above. It seems that one of the other two "new" bids was also a hard copy submission, so my theory above doesn't apply for this case. There is obviously another factor at play here too. I wonder if results go live as they're being entered on the BC Bid side. Maybe that's the problem, happening to look at the bids online just at the exact moment that someone is in the middle of entering the info.
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

Here are the results for a contract for Planting in Quesnel

Contract: PL25TLH008
Client: BCTS Quesnel
# of Trees: 1,222,620
Season: Spring 2024
Opened: November 21st, 2023
Contractor Rating System: Yes
Left on the Table: 15.9%

These seem like high bids for Quesnel. I don't know anything about this contract though. Good to see Seneca getting their turn for a win, after patiently be waiting for bid prices to come up to the level they wanted.

01. $1,106,912 - 90.5 cents/tree - Seneca
02. $1,283,154 - $1.05 per tree - Apex
Attachments
PL25TLH008 Unverified Bid Results.jpg
PL25TLH008 Unverified Bid Results.jpg (47.6 KiB) Viewed 126670 times
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Cyper »

PL25TLH008 - 612,340 t-bags
 This contract contains 48 cutblocks, with a total of 52 Planting Units.
 The contract is generally composed of regular harvest and wildfire blocks in the western areas of the Quesnel TSA.
 Total area for planting is 696.9 hectares (548.1 ha spring & 148.8 ha summer); this amounts to approximately 1.2 million seedlings (904k spring trees, 229k summer trees and 90k allowance for potential overflow trees). Number of seedlings will be revised following receipt of actual winter lift numbers from the nursery.
 There is approximately 477.3 ha of raw ground and 219.6 ha of site prepared ground. The site preparation includes trenches, mounds, screefs, and raised screefs
 Expect access to the blocks to require 4WD vehicles and ATVs, due to challenges with spring freshet.
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

Here are the results for a contract for Planting in Williams Lake

Contract: PL25TLE001
Client: BCTS Williams Lake
# of Trees: 1,309,560
Season: Spring 2024
Opened: November 28th, 2023
Contractor Rating System: Yes
Option-to-Renew: No
Left on the Table: 18.2%

This is for all of the work east of town, up near Horsefly and Likely. Quite a bit of multi-species work.

01. $ 913,414 - 69.7 cents/tree - Celtic
02. $1,079,521 - 82.4 cents/tree - Apex
Attachments
PL25TLE001_Information_to_Bidders.pdf
(193.73 KiB) Downloaded 124 times
PL25TLE001_Conditions_of_Tender.pdf
(214.62 KiB) Downloaded 134 times
PL25TLE001_Tender_Offer_Form_for_Hard_Copy_Submissions.pdf
(293.65 KiB) Downloaded 120 times
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

Here are the results for a contract for Planting in Mackenzie

Contract: PL25TGE007
Client: BCTS Mackenzie
# of Trees: 1,036,876
Season: Summer 2024
Opened: November 30th, 2023
Contractor Rating System: Yes
Option-to-Renew: No
Left on the Table: 46.7%

This one is fairly spread out, with trees on both the East and West side of Williston Lake.

This contract may be the best example yet of the oddities that we're seeing this bidding season. This is the second-most that I remember seeing left on the table on a job in the past decade. Dynamic could have bid almost half a million dollars more and would have still been the lowest bidder. But their bid is not low.

01. $1,002,588 - $96.7 cents/tree - Dynamic
02. $1,470,762 - $1.42 per tree - Blue Collar
03. $2,103,816 - $2.02 per tree - Summit
Attachments
PL25TGE007 Unverified Bid Results.jpg
PL25TGE007 Unverified Bid Results.jpg (136.2 KiB) Viewed 126064 times
PL25TGE007 Conditions_of_Tender.pdf
(159.43 KiB) Downloaded 133 times
PL25TGE007 Schedule_C-_Tree_Planting_Additional_Specifications.pdf
(881.58 KiB) Downloaded 120 times
PL25TGE007 Information_to_Bidders (1).pdf
(152.42 KiB) Downloaded 124 times
PL25TGE007 Tender_Offer_Form_for_Hard_Copy_Submission.pdf
(214.29 KiB) Downloaded 128 times
PL25TGE007 eAdvertisement.pdf
(762.29 KiB) Downloaded 121 times
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

Here are the results for another contract for Planting in Mackenzie

Contract: PL25TGE005
Client: BCTS Mackenzie
# of Trees: 2,041,023
Season: Spring 2024
Opened: November 28th, 2023
Contractor Rating System: Yes
Option to Renew: No
Left on the Table: 14.3%

This contract includes some easier spring ground, quite concentrated in the Porcupine and Sylvester areas.

01. $1,138,433 - 55.8 cents/tree - Coast Range
02. $1,301,628 - 63.8 cents/tree - Blue Collar
03. $1,466,586 - 71.6 cents/tree - Folklore
Attachments
PL25TGE005 Unverified Bid Results.jpg
PL25TGE005 Unverified Bid Results.jpg (122.91 KiB) Viewed 126064 times
PL25TGE005 Information_to_Bidders (1).pdf
(152.37 KiB) Downloaded 140 times
PL25TGE005 Conditions_of_Tender.pdf
(159.44 KiB) Downloaded 114 times
PL25TGE005 Tender_Offer_Form_for_Hard_Copy_Submission.pdf
(272.9 KiB) Downloaded 137 times
PL25TGE005 Schedule_C_-_Tree_Planting_Additional_Specifications_Revised.pdf
(877.12 KiB) Downloaded 128 times
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

Here are the results for a contract for Planting in Cache Creek

Contract: PL25FOR004
Client: Forsite/MOF
# of Trees: 729,700
Season: Spring 2024
Opened: November 27th, 2024
Contractor Rating System: N/A
Option to Renew: No
Left on the Table: 10.6%

This is some low elevation work scattered around Cache Creek, up the Vesey FSR, and up the Scottie Creek FSR. Some obstacle-only planting (ie. no fixed density, just hit obstacles) and one roadside block which will require tree delivery by helicopter as it has some sections which are too steep for ATV use.

01. $490,319 - 67.2 cents/tree - Folklore
02. $542,187 - 74.3 cents/tree - Apex
03. $583,760 - 80.0 cents/tree - Evergreen
04. $669,569 - 91.8 cents/tree - Torrent
05. $715,106 - 98.0 cents/tree - Fieldstone
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

Here are the results for a contract for Planting in Clinton

Contract: PL25CCF001
Client: Forsite/MOF
# of Trees: 894,280
Season: Spring 2024
Opened: November 27th, 2024
Contractor Rating System: N/A
Option to Renew: No
Left on the Table: 21.4%

More low elevation work up around Clinton on the Mound and Wolliben FSR's, etc. There's a bit of tricky access here, but it's most pretty straightforward burns from the Elephant Hill fire.

01. $510,481 - 57.1 cents/tree - Apex
02. $620,042 - 69.3 cents/tree - Torrent
03. $715,242 - 80.0 cents/tree - Evergreen
04. $746,273 - 83.4 cents/tree - Fieldstone
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Turner »

Scooter wrote: Sun Dec 03, 2023 5:18 am Here are the results for a contract for Planting in Clinton

Contract: PL25CCF001
Client: Forsite/MOF
# of Trees: 894,280
Season: Spring 2024
Opened: November 27th, 2024
Contractor Rating System: N/A
Option to Renew: No
Left on the Table: 21.4%

More low elevation work up around Clinton on the Mound and Wolliben FSR's, etc. There's a bit of tricky access here, but it's most pretty straightforward burns from the Elephant Hill fire.

01. $510,481 - 57.1 cents/tree - Apex
02. $620,042 - 69.3 cents/tree - Torrent
03. $715,242 - 80.0 cents/tree - Evergreen
04. $746,273 - 83.4 cents/tree - Fieldstone
Where do these Forsite/MOF bid results come from? Are they posted publicly, I have never found the source
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

They are shared with the bidders. Publicly funded trees.
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Turner »

Roger that, thanks.
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

I have approximately 6 more sets of results to post over the next couple of hours.

I'm going to make an attempt to start listing the traditional indigenous nation's territory within which each of the contracts falls from now on. I think it's important, in the spirit of Reconciliation, to make a better attempt at recognizing who the stewards of these various lands are. I am no expert in this, so if anyone has any experience in this and notices any errors on my part, please don't hesitate to correct me.
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

Here are the results for a contract for Planting in Boundary

Contract: PL25TFF001
Client: BCTS Nelson
# of Trees: 1,258,600
Season: Spring 2024
Opened: November 29th, 2023
Contractor Rating System: No
Left on the Table: 0.4%

Traditional Territory: Ĩyãħé Nakón mąkóce (Stoney), Syilx (Okanagan), sx̌ʷyʔiɬp (Colville)

A very close bid here.

01. $888,710 - 70.6 cents/tree - Fieldstone
02. $891,956 - 70.9 cents/tree - Evergreen
03. $976,099 - 77.6 cents/tree - Zanzibar
Attachments
PL25TFF001 Unverified Bid Results.jpg
PL25TFF001 Unverified Bid Results.jpg (107.63 KiB) Viewed 125716 times
PL25TFF001 eAdvertisement.pdf
(726.87 KiB) Downloaded 128 times
PL25TFF001_Sch_C_Other_Conditions.pdf
(718.7 KiB) Downloaded 121 times
PL25TFF001_Conditions_of_Tender.pdf
(160.06 KiB) Downloaded 125 times
PL25TFF001_Information_to_Bidders.pdf
(135.1 KiB) Downloaded 132 times
PL25TFF001_App_6_Grizzly_Bear_Encounter_Policy.pdf
(119.9 KiB) Downloaded 119 times
PL25TFF001_Tender_Offer_Form_Hardcopy.pdf
(155.78 KiB) Downloaded 117 times
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

Here are the results of a contract for Planting in Selkirk/Revelstoke

Contract: PL25DSE001
Client: MOF Castlegar
# of Trees: 14,020
Season: Spring 2024
Opened: December 4th, 2023
Contractor Rating System: N/A
Option-to-Renew: No

Traditional Territory: Ktunaxa ɁamakɁis, Secwepemcúl’ecw (Secwépemc)

This is the smallest bid of the year. There was only one bidder. Evergreen probably has other work in the area, making this convenient.

01. $15,262 - $1.089 per tree - Evergreen
Attachments
PL25DSE001 Unverified Bid Results.jpg
PL25DSE001 Unverified Bid Results.jpg (73.31 KiB) Viewed 125715 times
PL25DSE001 eAdvertisement.pdf
(893.89 KiB) Downloaded 129 times
PL25DSE001_Tender_Offer_Form-_Amended.pdf
(233.35 KiB) Downloaded 137 times
PL25DSE001_All_Tender_Documents.pdf
(537.86 KiB) Downloaded 119 times
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

Here are the results for a contract for Planting in Mackenzie

Contract: PL25TGE003
Client: BCTS Mackenzie
# of Trees: 1,990,551
Season: Spring 2024
Opened: December 5th, 2023
Contractor Rating System: Yes
Option to Renew: No
Left on the Table: 9.4%

Traditional Territory: Takla

Another win for Coast Range, to match their previous win in Mackenzie.

01. $1,273,036 - 64.0 cents/tree - Coast Range
02. $1,392,726 - 70.0 cents/tree - Blue Collar
Attachments
PL25TGE003 Unverified Bid Results.jpg
PL25TGE003 Unverified Bid Results.jpg (91.76 KiB) Viewed 125714 times
36_Tender_Offer_Form_for_Hard_Copy_Submission.pdf
(178.22 KiB) Downloaded 114 times
07_Schedule_C_-_Tree_Planting_Additional_Specification_Revised.pdf
(984.87 KiB) Downloaded 118 times
02_Conditions_of_Tender.pdf
(159.69 KiB) Downloaded 113 times
01_Information_to_Bidders (1).pdf
(219.15 KiB) Downloaded 114 times
PL25TGE003 eAdvertisement.pdf
(1.16 MiB) Downloaded 119 times
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

Here are the results for another contract for Planting in Mackenzie

Contract: PL25TGE006
Client: BCTS Mackenzie
# of Trees: 1,402,725
Season: Spring & Summer 2024
Opened: December 7th, 2023
Contractor Rating System: Yes
Option to Renew: No
Left on the Table: 10.4%

Traditional Territory: Takla

Garth should probably buy a house up in Mackenzie, they're cheap there. Garth, if you're reading this, there's a nice looking place for $165k on Blackwater Crescent with 4 bedrooms. It could be a great office and temporary summer home. Seriously though, this is the third win for Coast Range in Mackenzie, and it's going to be extremely efficient for them to be doing basically all of their trees for the season in the same region.

01. $ 891,224 - 63.5 cents/tree - Coast Range
02. $ 984,048 - 70.1 cents/tree - Summit
03. $1,050,500 - 74.8 cents/tree - Wright Holdings
04. $1,067,498 - 76.0 cents/tree - Blue Collar
05. $1,109,825 - 79.1 cents/tree - Dynamic
Attachments
PL25TGE006 Unverified Bid Results.jpg
PL25TGE006 Unverified Bid Results.jpg (174.67 KiB) Viewed 125714 times
PL25TGE006_Q&A_Document.pdf
(166.66 KiB) Downloaded 120 times
PL25TGE006_Conditions_of_Tender.pdf
(210.01 KiB) Downloaded 106 times
PL25TGE006_Tender_Offer_Form_for_Hard_Copy_Submission.pdf
(350.95 KiB) Downloaded 113 times
PL25TGE006_Information_to_Bidders.pdf
(160.69 KiB) Downloaded 126 times
PL25TGE006 eAdvertisement.pdf
(867.11 KiB) Downloaded 128 times
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

Here are the results for a contract for Planting in Fort St John

Contract: PL25TDF001
Client: BCTS Fort St John
# of Trees: 986,000
Season: Spring 2024
Opened: December 5th, 2023
Contractor Rating System: Yes
Option to Renew: No
Left on the Table: 13.9%

Traditional Territory: Dënéndeh, Beaver

Lots of young plantations that were burned in the fires this past summer (some blocks were still burning when I viewed this in October).

This is the easier of two contracts that are situated essentially side-by-side. The other contract has a lot more helicopter access.

01. $1,025,689 - $1.040 per tree - Folklore
02. $1,167,993 - $1.185 per tree - Seneca
03. $1,276,770 - $1.295 per tree - Blue Collar
04. $1,314,257 - $1.333 per tree - Apex
Attachments
PL25TDF001 Unverified Bid Results.jpg
PL25TDF001 Unverified Bid Results.jpg (148.06 KiB) Viewed 125713 times
08_Schedule_C_-_Supplementary_Specifications.pdf
(780.31 KiB) Downloaded 135 times
03b_Tender_Offer_Form_for_Hard_Copy_Submission.pdf
(190.37 KiB) Downloaded 128 times
02_Conditions_of_Tender.pdf
(159.4 KiB) Downloaded 119 times
01_BCTS_Information_to_Bidders.pdf
(374.49 KiB) Downloaded 141 times
PL25TDF001 eAdvertisement.pdf
(1.1 MiB) Downloaded 136 times
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

Here are the results for a contract for Planting near Kootenay Lake

Contract: PL25TFD005
Client: BCTS Nelson
# of Trees: 689,987
Season: Spring 2024
Opened: December 6th, 2023
Contractor Rating System: Yes
Option to Renew: No
Left on the Table: 27.2%

Traditional Territory: Secwepemcúl’ecw (Secwépemc), Confederated Tribes of the Colville Reservation, snʕickstx tmxʷúlaʔxʷ (Sinixt).

BCTS loves these guys.

01. $484,295 - 70.2 cents/tree - West Arm
02. $616,038 - 89.3 cents/tree - Zanzibar
03. $645,117 - 93.5 cents/tree - Fieldstone
04. $711,749 - $1.032 per tree - Brinkman
Attachments
PL25TFD005 Unverified Bid Results.jpg
PL25TFD005 Unverified Bid Results.jpg (136.98 KiB) Viewed 125711 times
PL25TFD005 eAdvertisement.pdf
(729.22 KiB) Downloaded 125 times
PL25TFD005_Conditions_of_Tender.pdf
(215.44 KiB) Downloaded 107 times
PL25TFD005_Sch_A_Tree_Planting.pdf
(914.79 KiB) Downloaded 125 times
PL25TFD005_Sch_C_Other_Conditions.pdf
(855.47 KiB) Downloaded 132 times
PL25TFD005_Information_to_Bidders.pdf
(169.42 KiB) Downloaded 112 times
PL25TFD005_Tender_Offer_Form_Hardcopy_Submission.pdf
(274.55 KiB) Downloaded 112 times
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

Here are the results for a contract for Cone Removal on Haida Gwaii

Contract: FH24TBJ002
Client: BCTS Chilliwack
Opened: November 30th, 2023
Left on the Table: 38.2% !!

Traditional Territory: Haida

This contract is for the removal of cones from trees on 22 blocks covering approximately 370 Ha, and where needed, fastening trees to stakes.

01. $238,832 - Osprey
02. $330,149 - 4C Forestry
03. $340,607 - Stephan Contracting
04. $495,559 - Whanau
Attachments
FH24TBJ002 Unverified Bid Results.jpg
FH24TBJ002 Unverified Bid Results.jpg (128.63 KiB) Viewed 125709 times
FH24TBJ002 eAdvertisement.pdf
(811.37 KiB) Downloaded 122 times
FH24TBJ002_Conditions_of_Tender.pdf
(209.4 KiB) Downloaded 110 times
FH24TBJ002_Schedule_A1_-_Protector_Removal_.pdf
(801.07 KiB) Downloaded 123 times
FH24TBJ002_Schedule_C_-_Other_Conditions.pdf
(686.48 KiB) Downloaded 116 times
FH24TBJ002_Information_to_Bidders.pdf
(105.6 KiB) Downloaded 137 times
FH24TBJ002_BCTS_Tender_Offer_Form_for_Hardcopy_Submission.pdf
(166.93 KiB) Downloaded 120 times
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

There is still a surprisingly large amount of public work yet to be awarded. I'm aware of at least 11.6 million trees yet to be awarded, just from BCTS alone.

There is already more public work tendered this year than any year that I can remember, even exceeding last year's numbers slightly. That can partly be explained by the large number of option-to-renew contracts that have been dropped this year.
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Cyper »

Now it will be interesting to see how the expectations of planters will be affected by news that prices are up significantly! If prices are up by 30% then should we expect to see planter prices rise by an equal amount? More importantly will planters expect that? If that's about to happen then what is the narrative?

Yes there's been a lot of catching up to do for contractors as far as rising costs born of inflation are concerned. What will be the actual effect of "loose" trees. Will this cause havoc with admin costs? Will "unaccounted for trees" become a major problem, overcounts, culls....forepersons endlessly counting partial boxes when moving blocks.

It seems there's always something changing that moves the goal posts for success in this tumultuous business.
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by jdtesluk »

The loose trees is going to be an issue. How much of an issue is unclear. Those who have tried it vary in their experience, but it greatly depends on shared caches, multi-species mixes, fast ground vs slow ground, and skill of the crew boss in distributing boxes. Ultimately it poses significant costs both to planters (counting and handling) and companies (administrating the chaos and stock handling). I think it will take several years to adjust and figure out the best tactics, but I could see it impacting production by as much as 10% in some situations. There may still be some work to do at the packing end to develop some manner of paper separators (faint hope clause).

Some other costs will be kicking in for first aid and OHS administration with changes in regulation which have been discussed before. However, the interpretation guidelines for Part 3 remain under review, and I suspect there could be some additional costs placed upon jobs where worksite access is limited (as in walk-ins and other no-drive-up settings). Some of these may have to be negotiated with licensees if heli-service is involved. At least most of those requirements won't kick in until 2024.

The other cost that may catch some companies out is Bill 41 and the now-explicit requirements related to injury-management, alternate work, and accommodating workers. Ultimately the bill places stricter duties on both employer AND employees, and provides some means of denying claims where workers are "playing the system". However, I tend to think those cases are relatively rare across the industry and that the net impact of the bill will be increased costs to employers to administrate their injury management systems in accordance with the Act. Some will pay more in responding proactively, some will end up paying through the nose by messing it up. We're having WSBC do a presentation at the WFCA conference on this exact issue, hopefully to help companies adjust accordingly.
So, along with other inflationary factors, I think companies will find that 30% (if they are smart or lucky enough to experience that increase) will get eaten up pretty fast. I expect there may be some increase in price this year, but not 30%, and there will likely be pressure for another wave of increased bid prices based on labour demand hitting the industry for the next season.
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

A few years ago, I pointed out how the average bid prices almost always trend upward as each bidding season progresses. This year is no exception. In fact, it's an especially strong example. I think that some of the foresters who still have contracts out for tender right now really wish that they had been able to post the tenders in August or September. It only makes sense that prices rise as each bidding season goes on, because some companies fill up their programs and cease bidding. The reduced competition later in the bidding season means that higher prices are common.
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

Here are the results for a contract for Planting in Mackenzie

Contract: PL25TGE004
Client: BCTS Mackenzie
# of Trees: 960,819
Season: Spring 2024
Opened: December 12th, 2023
Contractor Rating System: Yes
Option to Renew: No
Left on the Table: 14.0%

Traditional Territory: Tse’khene, Takla, Dënéndeh.

This contract is for blocks located near Fishroe Lake and Williston. There were only two bidders.

01. $1,091,351 - $1.136 per tree - Seneca
02. $1,244,130 - $1.295 per tree - Apex
Attachments
PL25TGE004 Unverified Bid Results.jpg
PL25TGE004 Unverified Bid Results.jpg (94.75 KiB) Viewed 125526 times
PL25TGE004 eAdvertisement.pdf
(1.14 MiB) Downloaded 124 times
33_Tender_Offer_Form_for_Hard_Copy_Submission.pdf
(200.68 KiB) Downloaded 120 times
06_Schedule_C_-_Tree_Planting_Additional_Specification.pdf
(984.95 KiB) Downloaded 140 times
02_Conditions_of_Tender.pdf
(159.59 KiB) Downloaded 118 times
01_Information_to_Bidders (1).pdf
(885.96 KiB) Downloaded 120 times
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

Here are the results for a contract for Planting in Prince George

Contract: PL25TGC001A
Client: BCTS Prince George
# of Trees: 1,387,600
Season: Spring & Summer 2024
Opened: December 11th, 2023
Contractor Rating System: No
Option to Renew: No
Left on the Table: n/a

Traditional Territory: Tse’khene, Dënéndeh, Takla.

This contract has approximate 368,300 spring trees and 1,019,300 summer trees. There was only one bidder.

01. $1,663,301 - $1.199 per tree - Wright Holdings
Attachments
PL25TGC001A Unverified Bid Results.jpg
PL25TGC001A Unverified Bid Results.jpg (64.04 KiB) Viewed 125526 times
37_Tender_Offer_Form_for_Hard_Copy_Submission.pdf
(211.27 KiB) Downloaded 129 times
07_Schedule_C_-_Tree_Planting_Additional_Specifications.pdf
(898.97 KiB) Downloaded 113 times
02_Conditions_of_Tender.pdf
(159.21 KiB) Downloaded 126 times
01_Information_to_Bidders (1).pdf
(129.57 KiB) Downloaded 114 times
PL25TGC001A eAdvertisement.pdf
(736.34 KiB) Downloaded 122 times
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by _I3^RELATIVISM »

What company is represented by this Wright Holdings corporation is it a new kid in the block or in representation of some older company I have been mostly focus on European tree planting not so much Canadian last 2 years.
Thanks for feedback in advance.
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

Wright Holdings Canada is a subsidiary of the company that bought out Spectrum Resource Group. They seem to be focusing less on planting and more on other types of silviculture work compared to Spectrum several years ago, but they're still doing some planting work.
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by jdtesluk »

Wright Holdings is part of Wright Tree Services, which is based in Iowa. It is an employee-owned company, and they have bought up several other similar companies, including Arborcare in Alberta. Crawford Young (formerly Silverado) who ran Spectrum's planting division has left the company, but there are still many people there from Crawford's time there.
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

Here are the results for a contract for Planting in Quesnel

Contract: PL25TLH005
Client: BCTS Quesnel
# of Trees: 802,020
Season: Spring 2024
Opened: December 21st, 2023
Contractor Rating System: Yes
Option to Renew: No
Left on the Table: 11.6%

I think this is the first that we've seen of AKD this year.

01. $568,220 - 70.8 cents/tree - AKD
02. $634,324 - 79.1 cents/tree - Seneca
03. $689,926 - 86.0 cents/tree - Blue Collar
04. $733,280 - 91.4 cents/tree - Apex
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

Here are the results for another contract for Planting in Fort St John

Contract: PL25TDF002
Client: BCTS Fort St John
# of Trees: 1,175,100
Season: Spring 2023
Opened: December 19th, 2023
Contract Rating System: Yes
Option-to-Renew: No
Left on the Table: 2.5%

This one is similar to the other Fort St John BCTS job, but has quite a bit more heli access. Great bid here by Seneca.

01. $1,499,818 - $1.276 per tree - Seneca
02. $1,537,638 - $1.309 per tree - Apex
03. $1,577,288 - $1.342 per tree - Folklore
04. $1,597,875 - $1.360 per tree - Rainforest
05. $2,703,330 - $2.301 per tree - Torrent
Attachments
PL25TDF002 Unverified Bid Results.jpg
PL25TDF002 Unverified Bid Results.jpg (142.28 KiB) Viewed 112723 times
03_Tender_Offer_Form_for_Hard_Copy_Submission.pdf
(269.23 KiB) Downloaded 47 times
02_Conditions_of_Tender.pdf
(186.1 KiB) Downloaded 38 times
01_BCTS_Information_to_Bidders (2).pdf
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Pl25TDF002 eAdvertisement.pdf
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

Here are the results for a bid for Planting in Quesnel

Contract: PL25TLH006
Client: BCTS Quesnel
# of Trees: 248,540
Season: Summer 2024
Opened: December 28th, 2023
Contractor Rating System: Yes
Option-to-Renew: No
Left on the Table: 32.8%

Trees in the Cascadia region.

01. $218,840 - 88.1 cents/tree - Blue Collar
02. $290,555 - $1.169 per tree - Dynamic
03. $347,933 - $1.400 per tree - Apex
04. $394,646 - $1.588 per tree - AKD
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

Here are the results for a contract for Planting in Merritt

Contract: PL25TEM631
Client: BCTS Merritt
# of Trees: 1,176,000
Season: Spring 2024
Opened: December 27th, 2023
Contractor Rating System: Yes
Option-to-Renew: No
Left on the Table: 3.6%

The results from this job have not been posted on BC Bid yet, but here they are.

01. $ 804,430 - 68.4 cents/tree - Zanzibar
02. $ 833,784 - 70.9 cents/tree - Westley Wall
03. $ 868,512 - 73.8 cents/tree - Leader
04. $ 885,400 - 75.2 cents/tree - Sitka
05. $1,206,000 - $1.026 per tree - A&G
Attachments
PL25TEM631_Q_A.pdf
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04__PL25TEM631_Tender_Offer_Form_for_Hard_Copy_Submission.pdf
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03__PL25TEM631_Conditions_of_Tender_Services.pdf
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02__PL25TEM631_Information_to_Bidders.pdf
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01__PL25TEM631_Table_of_Contents.pdf
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

Also, here's an updated version of my sort-of-annual "State Of The Industry" post:

https://jonathan-scooter-clark.blogspot ... -2024.html
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by MikeBH »

Thanks for all your work posting results. Especially digging out the ones that don't get released publicly.

It does seem like there's a bit of an uptrend in prices next season. But, will it be enough to attract and retain people? Only time will tell.
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Cyper »

MikeBH wrote: Thu Jan 11, 2024 1:07 pm T
It does seem like there's a bit of an uptrend in prices next season.
You sir are the master of understatement! From the numbers I've seen posted here so far, the rise in prices is far more than "a bit".

2023 bids per contract = 6.3 - 2024 there were 3.8

2023 average bid = $.608 - 2024 = $.808

2023 winning bid = $.480 - 2024 = $.660 - an increase of 38%!
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by jdtesluk »

I think Scooter was estimating the increase across "industry-wide" prices (public and private combined), as the public bid is only a fraction of all the work out there. Given that Folklore has a good chunk of direct-award work, he is probably extrapolating from that and information shared by other contractors.

This suggests that licensees are not willing to match (or even barely follow) the changes occurring in the open-bid market. Multi-year renewable bids could also contribute to keeping that average increase down.

I've seen some licensees be very receptive to their direct award contractor coming to them for price increases while pointing at the public-bids as reference points. Of course we've also seen some licensees balk at any increase, and split up their jobs among multiple contractors and tell contractors to take-it-or-leave-it with the threat of giving it to a competitor. Some contractors seem better at securing increases than others. Could be due to providing a good product, being reliable, and maintaining a good relationship. Could also be experience, and having security of other options if the licensee won't meet you part way.
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Cyper »

In that case it sounds like if I was a planter I should be looking to work for contractors who have government funded work as opposed to private direct award clients.
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

jdtesluk wrote: Sat Jan 13, 2024 6:58 pm Of course we've also seen some licensees balk at any increase, and split up their jobs among multiple contractors and tell contractors to take-it-or-leave-it with the threat of giving it to a competitor.
A bold strategy in a time when we're seeing some government jobs not getting any bids, despite the higher prices.
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by jdtesluk »

Cyper wrote: Mon Jan 15, 2024 11:20 am In that case it sounds like if I was a planter I should be looking to work for contractors who have government funded work as opposed to private direct award clients.
That was honestly my first thought too, and it would make sense if choosing between contractors that have exclusively one or the other. But of course, the majority of work is done by contractors who have both, and they likely move their budgets around as needed to establish some semblance of price equilibrium. No doubt there will be some smaller operations where people hit it big time (always has been, likely always will), but there are only so many seats in those trucks. Still, stories will be told about the other side of the fence this year and next.

Planters can spend all day trying to find the best job with the best earning opportunities, but I think most of us know there are so many more factors that can impact the profitability of a job....how soft is the ground, how big are the blocks, what are the specs, how solid is the supervisor, how long are the drives, how smokey or how floody does it get, does it green up early and so forth....Some of this cannot be predicted, although some of it can, which is why it is really nice when Scooter provides extra detail in the bids, and when companies put lots of information in job ads.
By all means, planters should look for their best options, but I don't think we can boil it down to just publicly-bid-is-better. Best money I made year after year was on long-term direct contracts where everything was dialed in tight.

If I had to boil it down to one factor to use in what makes a job a good score, it would be based on how closely the planting follows the snow melt...not waiting for it to melt, but getting to it as soon as it clears.....this involves complexities of snowpack, elevations, aspects, distribution of blocks across these factors, intimate knowledge of the land, how the weather pans out, and masterful use of Sentinel Playground. If I could develop a formula to calculate all this into a "how soon after the melt" formula, I think I would have a really good idea of where I would want to plant......of course if I could do that, I probably would be doing something else altogether.
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Scooter »

jdtesluk wrote: Mon Jan 15, 2024 9:50 pm how closely the planting follows the snow melt...
That's absolutely a key trick that some of us pay attention to during both scheduling of jobs and even earlier, during the Viewing season. One that rarely gets talked about publicly. You have to know the characteristics of the ground in each region of the province to understand where you have that perfect three week window versus where you don't need to rush. Moisture content is critical.
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Re: 2024 Public Bid Results

Post by Cyper »

jdtesluk wrote: Mon Jan 15, 2024 9:50 pm
The majority of work is done by contractors who have both, and they likely move their budgets around as needed to establish some semblance of price equilibrium.
Moving money between contracts to even wages out is a great idea but difficult to put into practice especially ahead of time. There are many factors that influence how much planters make exclusive of the bid price. To name a few: experience of the crew, soil moisture, supervisory organization, the checkers, the weather & morale. A happy well rested crew is a productive crew. A crew of rookies in their first week is a lot different than a crew of coastal vets hitting interior cream for the first time in the season. By the time management figures out that they have to bump prices up (if in fact they're willing), it may very well be too late. It's off to the next contract. Chances are they are already paying as much as they want to spend on other contracts and so are loathe to move money around.

I'm sure it does happen and certainly with social media contractors have to know that crews are "talking" to each other and comparing notes. It is critical to keep morale up and avoid the downward production spiral created when people think they are not making enough. We all know that production is inextricably linked to morale. I've seen crews plant many more trees per day on a replant of a block they planted two years ago simply because the price was a lot higher and the opportunity to make big bucks was there.

But I do agree with Jordan, contractors do keep a weather eye out to try to keep some sort of equality amongst crews. I just don't think it's that easy to do.

Certainly it's always a great idea to get there just after the snow melts to take advantage of the soft ground and lack of brush. But nevertheless I think planters are best advised to find contractors they trust to pay them a fair market wage, keep them safe and treat them with respect. Word gets around now more than ever. Unless a contractor is happy to populate their crews with rookies who don't know who to work for, they had best make sure their reputation amongst vets is top notch. Otherwise we'll find less and less people to do the work and so more and more non-completions.
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