Planting on Haida Gwaii

[Scooter]

Check this out:

https://www.facebook.com/events/549545161733022/

I know that logically, contract bidding should be open to a wide audience. But for this case, where Haida Gwaii is such a unique location and fairly independent economic system, it seems wrong not to go with a local contractor.

[mwainwright]

hell yes! this has HUGE implications for the future of our way of life on this island.
here are some emails that have been forwarded to me:

Dear Bidders

Thanks for your interest in Taan’s 2013 planting program and thanks for being patient in awaiting the bid results.

Taan’s 2013 planting contract will be awarded to Osprey Silviculture Operations Ltd.

Osprey has committed to significant on island employment and has a 25yr background with on-island planting and with the management of similar sized contracts.

Received bid results are presented below:
Osprey Silviculture Operations Ltd. $351 916.41
Stephan Contracting $388 334.72 diff. = $36 418.31
Haida Land Management Services Corp. $495 255.42 diff. = $143 339.01

Please feel free to contact me should you have any questions regarding the bid results and/or process. I look forward to working with you all again in the future.

Regards
Dave

[mwainwright]

here is another email between a concerned local planter (one of stephan's guys) and one of the foresters at Taan:

Dear Mr. Oike,



Thank you for your note. On-island employment is an essential part of Taan’s operations. There is a very large misunderstanding on-island right now in regards to Taan’s 2013 planting program. The final decision did not come down to cost but employment commitment and experience.



For your interest I will explain the process Taan went through to chose a planting contractor:

Every contract Taan advertises and the process of awarding that contract must be very open to the board of directors of HaiCo and its board members and stake holders. This is to ensure that Board members representing the communities of Haida Gwaii and the Haida Nation are aware of Taan’s decisions to ensure on-island employment requirements are met and that the money invested in the project is properly spent and not over spent. Taan cannot direct award contracts like these.

In January a request for proposal (RFP) was issued in the Observer for interested parties to reply to Taan Forest regarding the 2013 plant (I have attached the advertisement submitted to the Observer). There were three points that had to be addressed to Taan from the contractor. As on-island employment is a priority, the RFP stated that the provision of local employment is of most significance to the bid. Taan Forest generally uses a 50% 30% 20% rule when evaluating these types of bids. In order of weighting here are those points:

1) On-Island Employment – 50% (On Island Employment is split again)

a. 25% for local employment opportunity and training

b. 25% for Haida Ancestry employment opportunity and training

2) Experience of successfully completing 2 contract works of similar sized projects including planting over 100,000 trees each – 30%. Experience is also very important because of the quality and effort required to plant each tree, particularly the cedar trees and the associated tree protectors with them. Each cedar tree and cone costs about $5.00 for the tree, the cone, the stake and installation. We do not want to do that twice!

3) Bid – 20% The bid really is insignificant if the applicant can prove they can do a good job at 1 & 2.



Osprey Silviculture provided a very decent proposal with evidence proving # 1 & # 2 above the other bidders. Osprey is committing to On Island Employment including a 100% on-island hiring clause for the Taan work and working with Old Masset and Skidegate to find employees within the community and initiating a training program. Experience with programs similar to Taan’s 2013 program both Osprey and Stephan Contracting tied.



Taan Forest will be upholding Osprey Silviculture to their commitments made in their RFP response.

In regards to your employment and employment of your coworkers etc, I understand the hardships you are facing and that you potentially have lost an opportunity to work in 2013. I can only suggest that you talk to Greg Witt of Osprey Silviculture directly for employment opportunity and rate discussions as part of Osprey’s commitment to hire on-island people. You can contact Greg Witt at:

Greg Witt, President
Osprey Silviculture Operations Ltd.
T.250-474-7993
F.250-474-7990

Sincerely,



Jeff Mosher





I thought you might be interested that Osprey is planning on hiring %100 locals for the Taan contract.

So when do we start up?

Darrell

[The_Bearslayer]

here is another email between a concerned local planter (one of stephan's guys) and one of the foresters at Taan:

Dear Mr. Oike,



Thank you for your note. On-island employment is an essential part of Taan’s operations. There is a very large misunderstanding on-island right now in regards to Taan’s 2013 planting program. The final decision did not come down to cost but employment commitment and experience.



For your interest I will explain the process Taan went through to chose a planting contractor:

Every contract Taan advertises and the process of awarding that contract must be very open to the board of directors of HaiCo and its board members and stake holders. This is to ensure that Board members representing the communities of Haida Gwaii and the Haida Nation are aware of Taan’s decisions to ensure on-island employment requirements are met and that the money invested in the project is properly spent and not over spent. Taan cannot direct award contracts like these.

In January a request for proposal (RFP) was issued in the Observer for interested parties to reply to Taan Forest regarding the 2013 plant (I have attached the advertisement submitted to the Observer). There were three points that had to be addressed to Taan from the contractor. As on-island employment is a priority, the RFP stated that the provision of local employment is of most significance to the bid. Taan Forest generally uses a 50% 30% 20% rule when evaluating these types of bids. In order of weighting here are those points:

1) On-Island Employment – 50% (On Island Employment is split again)

a. 25% for local employment opportunity and training

b. 25% for Haida Ancestry employment opportunity and training

2) Experience of successfully completing 2 contract works of similar sized projects including planting over 100,000 trees each – 30%. Experience is also very important because of the quality and effort required to plant each tree, particularly the cedar trees and the associated tree protectors with them. Each cedar tree and cone costs about $5.00 for the tree, the cone, the stake and installation. We do not want to do that twice!

3) Bid – 20% The bid really is insignificant if the applicant can prove they can do a good job at 1 & 2.


Osprey Silviculture provided a very decent proposal with evidence proving # 1 & # 2 above the other bidders. Osprey is committing to On Island Employment including a 100% on-island hiring clause for the Taan work and working with Old Masset and Skidegate to find employees within the community and initiating a training program. Experience with programs similar to Taan’s 2013 program both Osprey and Stephan Contracting tied.



Taan Forest will be upholding Osprey Silviculture to their commitments made in their RFP response.

In regards to your employment and employment of your coworkers etc, I understand the hardships you are facing and that you potentially have lost an opportunity to work in 2013. I can only suggest that you talk to Greg Witt of Osprey Silviculture directly for employment opportunity and rate discussions as part of Osprey’s commitment to hire on-island people. You can contact Greg Witt at:

Greg Witt, President
Osprey Silviculture Operations Ltd.
T.250-474-7993
F.250-474-7990

Sincerely,



Jeff Mosher





I thought you might be interested that Osprey is planning on hiring %100 locals for the Taan contract.

So when do we start up?

Darrell

Hello. I'm Jeff Mosher, and I'm a motherfucking liar.

[backcountrysister]

Hey dirtybird...still waiting for my last paycheck from 03. Jeff Mosher. How the fuck do you sleep at night eating you own bullshit. FOR SHAME FOR SHAME! Could say alot worst but maybe BCFSC can do something along with WCB.

[RavenDawnMcKenzie]

Hmm I recall a few years ago asking AssSpray to get paid as I had been waiting almost two months. Greg Witt responded eventually by telling me I would not be welcome back. I wasn't asking to work for your third world impoverished excuse of a company. Just want to GET PAID Greg. What a concept. Getting paid for your work! Well it's too bad people out there think they actually have to put themselves through such degradation. DON'T DO IT!!!

[backcountrysister]

Hmm I recall a few years ago asking AssSpray to get paid as I had been waiting almost two months. Greg Witt responded eventually by telling me I would not be welcome back. I wasn't asking to work for your third world impoverished excuse of a company. Just want to GET PAID Greg. What a concept. Getting paid for your work! Well it's too bad people out there think they actually have to put themselves through such degradation. DON'T DO IT!!!

I just dont get how Gregg Witt - less can still work. I guess bottom dwelling leaches like him only care about profit margins. I mean - anyone & everyone should read the horror stories that have occured on Vancouver Island over the last decade plus! maybe a link to the replant site for TAAN . Maybe then TAAN will get a clue as to whom their are trusting their community lands with.
I spent my few hrs of peace so enraged, wondering WTF can we do as a planting community & as individuals? I know we all need to work. these are tough times. but nobody works for free & guess what QSI... your people will. come on people. dont do it!

[Tnalp]

Good luck to all.

A friend of mine is going to work for osprey this spring, mostly because the other local contractor he worked for is 'retired". He is definitely not local. I have never heard of 100% local employment for any sizeable Planting job over the last 20 years!! I can't see how the Dirty bird will do it. Oh yeah they won't.

If these guys are as bad as people say, which i believe. They should be put under the microscope if they actually do the job. This can be done by a local who had no choice but to work for them or even one or more of the board members of Taan. These members must be neighbours with some of the affected planters. There must be ways to get insight into the selection process. Sounds like a low bid wins it situation!

Anyway, any employment standard infractions any safety violations anything could definitely help with not having them be eligible to bid again. Remember workers are entitled to be paid REGULARLY along the lines of the Employment standards.

I have been on the record as not being a supporter of the remaining local contractor's management style. But I have also been on the record as to the fact that he has very good prices and always pays. Not to mention his commitment to locals.

Good luck to all.

[chrisdunn]

Good luck guys.

As an off islander I have had the opportunity to work on Haida Gwaii a handful of times. I'd like another shot at it, I love it there, but not at the expense of a local's position if he/she can do the job just as good.

I like it so much there, I took my wife over for a 5 day vacation so she could see what the big appeal was, she loved it.

[The_Bearslayer]

Hmm I recall a few years ago asking AssSpray to get paid as I had been waiting almost two months. Greg Witt responded eventually by telling me I would not be welcome back. I wasn't asking to work for your third world impoverished excuse of a company. Just want to GET PAID Greg. What a concept. Getting paid for your work! Well it's too bad people out there think they actually have to put themselves through such degradation. DON'T DO IT!!!

I just dont get how Gregg Witt - less can still work. I guess bottom dwelling leaches like him only care about profit margins. I mean - anyone & everyone should read the horror stories that have occured on Vancouver Island over the last decade plus! maybe a link to the replant site for TAAN . Maybe then TAAN will get a clue as to whom their are trusting their community lands with.
I spent my few hrs of peace so enraged, wondering WTF can we do as a planting community & as individuals? I know we all need to work. these are tough times. but nobody works for free & guess what QSI... your people will. come on people. dont do it!

Every company cares about profit margins above all else, that isn't the point. What bothers me is a mill lauding the work of a contractor that stashes a shitload of trees everywhere they plant and does a shitty job of planting the trees they do plant. Osprey crews on the Charlottes are usually expected by the owners to stash. The foremen often assign stashing duties and set quotas.

[RPF]

Osprey crews on the Charlottes are usually expected by the owners to stash. The foremen often assign stashing duties and set quotas.

You're kidding right? I mean wouldn't the forester(s) looking after the project suspect something??

[mcD]

I have had this confirmed by many former Osprey planters. Foresters are a lot less likely to suspect anything on heli and boat jobs.

[Tnalp]

How many trees on this job? Is the job still going to Osprey despite all the local pushback? Good Luck!

[The_Bearslayer]

I was hanging out a few days ago with a good friend who planted for Osprey in the Charlottes a few years ago. According to him the stashing on the contract was coordinated by the forester and supervisor together. In order to keep the logging camp open for planters a certain number of blocks had to be available for planting the following year. Therefore, a smaller number of blocks were overprescribed and the trees that didn't fit into them were stashed. Many of the spruce, which didn't require cones, were stashed, while the cedar were all planted. Otherwise they would have had to destroy a bunch of stakes and cones, which would have indicated that people higher up than planters were responsible if the stashing were somehow discovered.

[Casper]

That's absolutely disgusting...

[A-Bomb]

Nothing new yet, Osprey put an ad in the newspaper looking for planters, somehow they are going to pull a local crew out of thin air?

[mwainwright]

here is more from Taan, answering questions raised at our protest earlier this month.

Taan Forest Response – Questions from Friday March 8th, 2013
Demonstration
Below you will find the questions provided to Taan Forest at Friday’s demonstration in front of the Taan Office in Skidegate with an
associated answer to that question
Q - On what basis was Osprey awarded the contract?
A - Every contract Taan advertises is considered a competitive bid
In January a request for proposal (RFP) was issued in the Observer for interested parties to reply to Taan Forest regarding the 2013
plant. There were three points that had to be addressed to Taan from the contractor. As on-island employment is a priority, the
RFP stated that the provision of local employment is of most significance to the bid. Taan Forest generally uses a percentage rule
on three categories when evaluating these types of bids:
Local Employment (50%)
Previous experience (30%)
Price (20%)
Osprey Silviculture out scored the other bidders in these categories
Q - Why hasn’t Osprey contacted any locals for jobs?
A - Contract was only awarded Monday March 4, 2013. We are currently advised by Osprey that Four locals are currently working
for Osprey on a cone removal project and will be moving forward on the planting contract, Two additional long time planters onIsland for Osprey will be working on this project, and eight individuals have been contacted in Masset.
Q - What will happen if the contract requirements are not fulfilled?
A - Like any contract if the requirements of the contract are not fulfilled there will be remedial actions – those actions are dependent
on why the contract was not fulfilled.
Q- Will Osprey’s contract be revoked if they do not follow through with their commitment to hire local?
A- It would be. Due to timing of trees arriving etc a direct award contract would have to be issued.
Q - Can we get a commitment from Bob Brash that he/Taan will ensure that the 100% local employment clause is fulfilled?
A - It is a 100% hire clause and, yes that commitment was in place prior to the award of the contract.
Q - Is a list going to be made available of all the locals that are going to be employed by Osprey?
A- No, this is an employee/employer matter. However, we will be, as a condition of the contract, monitoring names and confirming
them as local.
Q - If not, what sort of proof will be provided to show 100% local employment?
A - As per previous answers, Taan will monitor, confirm, and maintain compliance with the contract conditions. Stats will be
provided to Haico, as normal, on an annual basis of local employment. Haico releases annual reports of person days worked and
local employment
Q- How will Osprey determine and prove that an employee is in fact, local?
A - Similar to last year’s contract in which a PO Box was provided. If there are concerns, Taan will investigate further.
Q - To what extent were Osprey’s references checked?
A - 100%
Q - Does Osprey work for Island Timberlands? If not, why? What kind of reference did Island Timberlands give for Osprey?
A - Yes Osprey works for Island Timberlands and several other clients. ITLP gave Osprey a fair reference, additional time was
required with crew and there were some quality/density issues but nothing major
Q – Is Taan aware of the apparent claims against Osprey with the Labour Board?
A - There are no labour claims against Osprey Silviculture on the Labour Boards website
Q - What are the losses to the community financially by hiring Osprey over Stephan?
A - We do not see any losses; in fact we see more from Osprey as a significant boost to Port Clements was given to them through
the rental of all the rooms at Golden Spruce and a hostel in PC. Osprey is keeping the entire crew together to avoid individuals
missing the crew bus to work in the morning.WWW .TAANFOREST. COM | 4. 7100 RI VER RD RICH MOND BC | V6 X1 X5 1. 778 . 386. 7756
Q - Why were we (Stephan’s Crew) lead on? -this is in reference to previous dialogue that may have insinuated that the contract
was going to be awarded to Stephan.
A - No one from Taan “lead” on Stephan Contracting that he would be awarded this year’s contract. Just like last year and any of
Taan’s contracts, it was a competitive bid. In terms of up and coming contracts, Taan did discuss potential cone removal contracts
at a $/ha basis but decisions have not been made or any works previously promised.
Q - How can Osprey develop a training program for new planters when all the local experienced planters are already working for
Stephan and will not work for Osprey?
A - It will be Osprey’s responsibility to hire and train the necessary planters to deliver the contract. They have indicated a desire to
hire additional local planters.
Q - Is Osprey’s plan of action going to be made available, and will we have access to it?
A - No, Taan would not ask other contractors to make their plan available. By any definition of a contract, it is the contractor’s
responsibility to determine how they will achieve a result; Taan will monitor to ensure the results are met.
Q - If Osprey says they are going to consult SBC/OMVC to employ Haida, why have neither council heard of any of this yet?
A - Contract was only awarded on Monday. SBC/OMVC was also not aware of Stephan Contracting looking for workers.
Q - Concerns and comments about Osprey’s previous track record with timely payment to the planters.
A – There are no reports or claims against Osprey with the Labour Relations Board
Q - Who is eligible for the training program? In a previous email it states that training is available for Masset and Skidegate
residents. It does not mention Queen Charlotte residents.
A - Correction – it will be available to any inexperienced planter
Q - Who was directly responsible for making the decision to hire Osprey?
A - Taan Forest
Q - Is it true that the Haico Board did NOT participate in the decision making process and also that they were not made aware of the
decision until after the contract was already awarded to Osprey?
A - The role of the Board is to set general strategies and policies; not to be involved in operational matters and decisions. As
necessary, a Board will audit operations if they believe there are issues.
Q - How is Taan going to ensure that Osprey’s quality of work is not only legitimate but of the highest standard as well?
A - Their contract will be monitored as per both the requirements of the actual contract and provincial standards. As normal, Taan
will have field staff actively ensuring compliance.
Q - Where does the funding come from for tree planting for Taan?
A - Planting dollars (costs) come directly from Taan Forest.
Sincerely,
W.R. Brash
COO HaiCo Enterprises

[Scooter]

Some very politically correct answers there. Many make sense. A few are particularly appropriate, even though they aren't necessarily the sort of answers that a planter might want to hear. For example:

A - The role of the Board is to set general strategies and policies; not to be involved in operational matters and decisions. As
necessary, a Board will audit operations if they believe there are issues.

That makes sense. There is always a distinction, when Boards of Directors are involved, between governance and direct operations/management.

However, one question that jumps out at me quickly is this:

A - As per previous answers, Taan will monitor, confirm, and maintain compliance with the contract conditions. Stats will be
provided to Haico, as normal, on an annual basis of local employment. Haico releases annual reports of person days worked and
local employment

My concern would be that annual statistics are a sure-fire way to allow problems to slip past, because problems are not identified until long after-the-fact. However (and I should emphasize that I don't understand all the relationships in this situation) I think this could also be interpreted that Taan is essentially admitting responsibility here for compliance, so the fact that Haico releases statistics on an annual basis is not a cause for alarm?


Also, this comment jumps out:

Q – Is Taan aware of the apparent claims against Osprey with the Labour Board?
A - There are no labour claims against Osprey Silviculture on the Labour Boards website

For all the complaints by coastal and other multi-year vets about how Interior companies are the root of all evil because of their exploitation of workers (Ok, those are my comments, perhaps a bit extreme) I find it odd that Osprey has no Employment Standards Commission complaints currently registered. Why is this? Do people only complain online when they have the anonymity of the internet to "protect" them? Do they not take the effort to register an official complain with the ESB when their own earnings have been affected? Is the lack of complaints on the website due to the fact that there ARE complaints, but they're not getting posted to the ESB website (which I haven't looked at) in a timely manner? Is it because only certain types of complaints are posted (perhaps only ones where a judgement goes against the alleged infractor)? Is it because there aren't any actual complaints? And if there aren't any actual complaints, is that because there haven't really been any violations, or because planters who have been hurt by ESB violations haven't bothered to take the time to make an official complaint to the board? If it's the latter, then these planters, who are generally quite experienced, should be just as guilty of undermining the strength of the industry as contractors who are underbidding each other in many areas of the province. How can a bad company (in general) be expected to clean up its act if nobody comes forward to let the appropriate regulatory agencies know about problems? However, that's a general debate that we should have in a different thread, because I don't want to undermine the importance of the situation on Haida Gwaii, which is being discussed here.


These answers are interesting information. However, they still don't answer a bigger question. Even though contract compliance might be appear to be in the process of being addressed, in a technical sense, I think a lot of people in the planting community are concerned about what will happen to regular employees from SC. Thanks for keeping us posted Mike.

[jules]

Also, this comment jumps out:

Q – Is Taan aware of the apparent claims against Osprey with the Labour Board?
A - There are no labour claims against Osprey Silviculture on the Labour Boards website

For all the complaints by coastal and other multi-year vets about how Interior companies are the root of all evil because of their exploitation of workers (Ok, those are my comments, perhaps a bit extreme) I find it odd that Osprey has no Employment Standards Commission complaints currently registered. Why is this? Do people only complain online when they have the anonymity of the internet to "protect" them? Do they not take the effort to register an official complain with the ESB when their own earnings have been affected? Is the lack of complaints on the website due to the fact that there ARE complaints, but they're not getting posted to the ESB website (which I haven't looked at) in a timely manner? Is it because only certain types of complaints are posted (perhaps only ones where a judgement goes against the alleged infractor)? Is it because there aren't any actual complaints? And if there aren't any actual complaints, is that because there haven't really been any violations, or because planters who have been hurt by ESB violations haven't bothered to take the time to make an official complaint to the board? If it's the latter, then these planters, who are generally quite experienced, should be just as guilty of undermining the strength of the industry as contractors who are underbidding each other in many areas of the province. How can a bad company (in general) be expected to clean up its act if nobody comes forward to let the appropriate regulatory agencies know about problems? However, that's a general debate that we should have in a different thread, because I don't want to undermine the importance of the situation on Haida Gwaii, which is being discussed here.

Just FYI, ESB complaints only show up on the searchable part of their website when the claim makes it to arbitration, and the ESB's process is intended to minimize the amount of arbitration they have to do. If the dispute is resolved before arbitration, it doesn't go online.

[Scooter]

Good info, thanks Jules.

[jules]

Good info, thanks Jules.

No problem. I agree with you, though, that people who don't make complaints when they're warranted are a part of the problem. They turn a company's exploitative behavior into a numbers game that can let them get away with things they shouldn't and help reinforce lowball bidding. If a company rips 15 people off for $100, and only three people file complaints about it, it's in the company's interest to pay out the $300 (and keep the other $1200) rather than risk having to pay out that, maybe more, plus fines, and gaining a searchable ESB record.

This is one of the reasons why forums like this are valuable; they let planters discuss scummy employer behavior outside the labor standards process and share which companies and contracts to avoid.

[Tnalp]

Looks like Osprey has Taan and Husby and Stephan has Island Timberlands and BCTS. Seems like most of Stephan's guys should have enough work. Good for you guys. How many full time island residents work for Stephan at this stage maybe a dozen I'm guessing. Anyway I'm glad to see that it seems that you guys will be fine... this year anyway. Is this accurate?

[Tnalp]

They said that last years contract was a 100% local requirement? Who did that? PO BOX for proof of being local is a scam. I hope last years contractor did not bring on any off-islander or else this is all just BS from Haico-Taan!!

[mwainwright]

Last year's contract with Taan did NOT require a 100% local work force, and stephan's crew was at about 80%. This represents 25 or 26 full time island residents, depending who you ask.

[Tnalp]

Why is Haico even requiring 100% they must realize that there has to be some exceptions here and there?

What about the 3rd bidder, what's their story? Just curious.

[mwainwright]

Why is Haico even requiring 100% they must realize that there has to be some exceptions here and there?

this is haico/taan paying lip service to their commitments under the forest stewardship council, who has already received several formal complaints about this matter. check out the FSC's principles and criteria, in particular principle #4: https://ca.fsc.org/principles-criteria.195.htm . i spoke with the auditor from the rainforest alliance, who is the FSC-accredited body that issued taan's certificate, and she told me that a PO box does not make you a local resident. she will be asking taan to provide more robust documentation of having hired a 100% local crew, and will be checking the credentials of each name provided. we shall see what happens.

What about the 3rd bidder, what's their story? Just curious.

you are referring to the Haida Land Management Corp. a joint venture between the old massett village council (represented by john disney, the guy that dumped the iron in the ocean) and Silverwood consulting ( paul hanna ) of terrace. as to what these guys are up to, i dont really know.

[Tnalp]

So did they just want to go for the lowest bid or is there more to this?

[jdtesluk]

Also, this comment jumps out:

Q – Is Taan aware of the apparent claims against Osprey with the Labour Board?
A - There are no labour claims against Osprey Silviculture on the Labour Boards website

For all the complaints by coastal and other multi-year vets about how Interior companies are the root of all evil because of their exploitation of workers (Ok, those are my comments, perhaps a bit extreme) I find it odd that Osprey has no Employment Standards Commission complaints currently registered. Why is this? Do people only complain online when they have the anonymity of the internet to "protect" them? Do they not take the effort to register an official complain with the ESB when their own earnings have been affected? Is the lack of complaints on the website due to the fact that there ARE complaints, but they're not getting posted to the ESB website (which I haven't looked at) in a timely manner? Is it because only certain types of complaints are posted (perhaps only ones where a judgement goes against the alleged infractor)? Is it because there aren't any actual complaints? And if there aren't any actual complaints, is that because there haven't really been any violations, or because planters who have been hurt by ESB violations haven't bothered to take the time to make an official complaint to the board? If it's the latter, then these planters, who are generally quite experienced, should be just as guilty of undermining the strength of the industry as contractors who are underbidding each other in many areas of the province. How can a bad company (in general) be expected to clean up its act if nobody comes forward to let the appropriate regulatory agencies know about problems? However, that's a general debate that we should have in a different thread, because I don't want to undermine the importance of the situation on Haida Gwaii, which is being discussed here.

Just FYI, ESB complaints only show up on the searchable part of their website when the claim makes it to arbitration, and the ESB's process is intended to minimize the amount of arbitration they have to do. If the dispute is resolved before arbitration, it doesn't go online.

I wonder if a FOIPA request would provide additional information?

[RPF]

I was hanging out a few days ago with a good friend who planted for Osprey in the Charlottes a few years ago. According to him the stashing on the contract was coordinated by the forester and supervisor together. In order to keep the logging camp open for planters a certain number of blocks had to be available for planting the following year. Therefore, a smaller number of blocks were overprescribed and the trees that didn't fit into them were stashed. Many of the spruce, which didn't require cones, were stashed, while the cedar were all planted. Otherwise they would have had to destroy a bunch of stakes and cones, which would have indicated that people higher up than planters were responsible if the stashing were somehow discovered.

When you say "forester" are you referring to a professional forester registered with the Association of BC Forest Professionals? If so, I'm sure that the association would be interested in hearing about this case. If what you're saying is true, this type of behavior and action violates a few ethical bylaws that all registered foresters are bound by, and should be reported to the association.

[Tnalp]

Any updates?

[McgeeMcgee]

I worked on this contract last year. Out of the 20-25 planters I think 2-3 were "local." And by local I mean hipsters from Vancouver who were hanging out on haida gwaii. Most of my buddies were going back this year so I doubt that too much has changed.

[Tnalp]

Hopefully Haico will be held to account!! I don't really care about Osprey, It's when the "higher ups" pay lip service and spew hypocrisy that it bugs me. Keep at em. I don't believe that simply because you have a historical first nation connection to anywhere or anything that you will by default act in a more enlightened manner. People are people. Money is money! The sea otter population was nearly destroyed by first nations people supplying the Russians. Greed has been around since time immemorial.

Good luck!!

[b-dawg]

This whole thing is a disgrace…on so many levels. Everybody with any Coastal Planting experience has heard what kind of despicable things planters have been subject to while working on contracts for Osprey. Their track-record speaks for itself: they are the absolute lowest-of-the-low. I'm in total disbelief that they were awarded this contract.

It’s very curious that Taan selected Osprey on the grounds of a 'local hiring practice' clause, given that OSPREY IS AN OFF-ISLAND COMPANY. In years past they brought their crew (made up of folks desperate enough to work for much less money, and in way less safe conditions than most any other company not named Khaira) up from Vancouver Island to Prince Rupert - from where they'd fly in to Husby's remote access logging camp on Haida Gwaii.
Stephan (THE LOCAL ON-ISLAND CONTRACTOR) has a long track-record of hiring entirely local, except for a few returning off-Island planters, and his crew is made up predominantly of highly-experienced professional planters. So, in terms of who has a history of employing locals on Haida Gwaii, there's NO case to be made that Osprey could ever compete with Stephan in this regard. The local crew has always been one that does the job exceptionally well, for a well-paid wage. And all of those local planters, who know that TFL (and it's demanding silviculture specs) like the back of their hand through their decades-long experience -- they would never offer their expertise to a shoddy, non-local, unsafe, unprofessional outfit like Osprey in return for a pittance in wages.

The reality is that there seems to be a conflict of interest going on. The 'local hiring practice' clause was a technicality that was employed to award the contract to Osprey (a technicality that makes no sense, and that Osprey won't be able to deliver on - as evidenced by the fact that they are renting rooms in the motel in Port Clements for their off-island planters). So why then would this be posited as a reason to award the contract to Osprey? Well, the only reason that makes sense is that Taan has employed a consultant who works for Husby. The consultant who works for Husby must have some kind of business connection with Osprey, as that is who they have awarded their planting contracts to over the past several years. Given the previous posts alluding to foresters for Husby being complicit in the stashing practice that goes on in Osprey, it's not a stretch to connect the dots.

To the managers who made this decision, and to the people who are planting for Osprey:

The effects of this are far-reaching. A long-term contract that has been run by a local contractor for many years, was awarded to an off-island contractor under suspicious circumstances. The difference in the product that either company is able deliver cannot be overstated. The long-time local planters are not willing to work for Osprey and have their own reputation tarnished as a result. This must be extremely difficult for all of the local families that I know in Haida Gwaii who have always relied on treeplanting for seasonal income. Many consecutive years of locals working for the local contractor created a very positive situation on Haida Gwaii – economically, for all of the communities; environmentally, in terms of the quality of planting and stand-tending; and socially, in terms of community relationships. It’s really a shame that the decision-makers responsible for awarding this contract have made the choice to completely change things for the worse. Actually, it’s unbelievably depressing.

[Tnalp]

I haven't called any of my friends on Haida Gwaii to get a sense of where things are at but I do hope that those who felt treated in an unjust, even corrupt manner will follow thru with this situation to the best of their abilities!

Talk is fine but I do applaud those who have had the wherewithal and will to act.

Good Luck

[SwampDonkey]

I believe I may have an answer as to the consultant working for Husby, it may not be thee correct answer as I have no current inside information. But, I worked up there in that camp and the consultant was Coast Forest Management who once had an office in Prince Rupert, managed by Colin Benoit. But the main office is in Campbell River. Their wages to foresters where not that great either for working remote areas. The owner of that company is Gordy Atkins if I recall. They also had a small presence in Queen Charlotte City. I can say one thing that the door was always revolving at that place and every shift brought in a new face. Lots of unpaid over time work done in the evenings, but be sure that no everyone was treated the same. There were favorites. Been there done that.

[clay]

Ummm... Red rot, tree outside the tube.... Its all there...

image.jpg (244.49 KiB) Viewed 30280 times

Previously on A Game of Cones...

It's pretty tense in port clements! Osprey continues on in breach of contract, working the Taan contract with their "PO box locals"... (Q: How many local treeplanters can you stuff into a po box? A: i dont know, ask greg witt!). Taan continues to turn a blind eye to this. Any day now osprey's husby job will end and they will almost certainly be shifting that crew onto the taan job (surely they've been here long enough to qualify as locals by now, right?) They are so far behind on the taan job that they wont have much of a choice... Unless they plan on planting till july... For the record, stephan's crew was finished the taan job right around this time last year - with a small actually local crew.

The whole thing is a total farce. Unfortunately the victims are not only the local planters, but the plantations themselves... Osprey is completely unsuited to do this job... And anyone with half a brain can see that. Stephan's crew has built a reputation on excellent quality, and combined has around 200 years of silviculture experience ON TAAN'S TFL!! To say that we as a crew are emotionally and otherwise Invested inthe land itself would be an understatement. I alone have planted >400,000 trees on haida gwaii, the vast majority of those in taan's tfl. The injury that is lost work and wages is made far worse by the insult of seeing a sh*tslap company like osprey pick up where we left off. This contract has always been extremely demanding in terms of quality. through all of the changes in licensees (m&b, weyerhauser, cascadia, wfp etc.), all have seen the VALUE in hiring the local contractor(s, when jean-marc was still planting). Quality actually means something out here - cones have to stand up to the crazy haida gwaii storms... And the irony in all those big licensees retaining stephan only to lose the work when local interests take over is almost too much...

It goes without saying that osprey is just slamming trees in every which way but sideways, but i did have had opportunity to drive thru a block or two and witness the devestation firsthand. Altho the photos dont quite do it justice, it gives you a bit of an idea...[attachment=2]image.jpg[/attachment][attachment=1]image.jpg[/attachment]

[Jimbo the Mook]

Good onya, Clay, for posting these pics and showing us the sloppy handiwork of the shitbird. While I've never planted on Haida Gwaii myself, I know many people who have, and who've worked for Stephan, and maybe still are working for him. It's a travesty to see a highly respected contractor like him potentially lose his shirt to these assholes. I hope things eventually work out for everyone involved – except for Osprey, of course.

[clay]

Just a classic line of osprey leaners...

image.jpg (332.71 KiB) Viewed 30257 times

Thx jimbo... Took about 60 shots of total garbage planting, but i probably should have just shot a video- might have been easier to see the widespread carnage... Any checker or forester not worried about losing their job could/would/should have failed it from the road. Clearly osprey is being given a free pass here and i dont think taan realizes what it is going to cost them in the end - most of those tubes are coming down with the next big haida gwaii storm.

[Tnalp]

Good point! Who is (are) the checker(s)? Is it being done in-house? Must be as I can't see any objective 3rd party being complicit in any of these ongoings. It doesn't take all that much to plant a bad tree when your coning.. I know I've inspected 100's of thousands of them and it only takes a few of the elements not done correctly to have the cone and tree just get nuked by the first avg storm!

[SwampDonkey]

I know when I worked out of Eden Lake, that Husby sent their own checker. I couldn't say how thorough they checked the planting because I never worked with them. I do remember one steep site getting done 3 times. Not because of the planting, but it would wash out/slide. CFM also did silviculture surveys and cruising. I can say those surveys were done as well as could be, especially the cruising as I was a cruiser. And I didn't cruise from a pickup truck window. We would call in MOF to check completed blocks and never had a fail. I also got my certification.

[b-dawg]

Just to make it clear for those that may not understand: the pictures of Osprey's handywork that expose those planting faults, those faults actually equate to dead trees. Dead/fault trees equate to failed blocks, and more importantly to a totally inadequate (or non-existent) future forest - which will have to be replanted and reworked. (Or overlooked...?)
The deer-browse on Haida Gwaii is not a joke: if the trees are not properly protected, they simply don't grow. Compounding the problem is the insane weather that Clay referred to, which means if a stake is not driven in straight, and to the proper depth with TWO firmly secured zap-straps - it is a fault (and a dead tree) because it will not stay secured through the first storm that hits. Also, due to the way the quality is calculated, and the fact that most blocks have a prescription calling for a mix of species, 1 tube fault in a plot can cause quality problems over a significant portion of a block. Because the protectors are on the cedar, which is planted usually around 400-600 stems per HA (with other species mixed in), a few consecutive plots with a tube fault can immediately fail a whole block.

To reiterate:

This contract has always been extremely demanding in terms of quality. through all of the changes in licensees (m&b, weyerhauser, cascadia, wfp etc.), all have seen the VALUE in hiring the local contractor(s, when jean-marc was still planting). Quality actually means something out here - cones have to stand up to the crazy haida gwaii storms...

What's really twisted is this fact: while the LOCALS who work for the LOCAL contractor have always been able to deliver on the strict quality demands, because
a) they understand their LOCAL ecosystem, and
b) have always been held accountable by the LOCAL checkers/foresters, and
c) are paid a wage that reflects the time it takes to do the job right---
Osprey, the NON-LOCAL contractor (with their NON-LOCAL workers) who can't deliver on these demands, is being given a free pass because the checking/implementation is also being carried out by a 3rd-party NON-LOCAL company.

The other hilarious part is the production aspect: those yahoos shit-slapping in the trees for Osprey could never even approach the type of production that Stephan's crew can do (while doing the job right).

So then why is all of this happening?

The story gets interesting when you start to look into the where the money-trail leads...

[mwainwright]

Here is a link to the results of a forestry forum that was held back in October

http://www.taanforest.com/Forest_Forum_online_V3.pdf

[_I3^RELATIVISM]

I heard that all contracts were awarded to one contractor in Haida Gwaii this year.

[_I3^RELATIVISM]

Is this correct? It seams that was the case given his focus in hiring local people instead for the most part?

[Scooter]

Yes. Stephan Contracting got the work. And that was a good thing to see. The Haida are very concerned about the potential for outsiders to bring Covid into their territory. With tourism shut down, tree planting was one major remaining risk vector. Stephan is the only company that would be able to put together a workforce of locals, and they're a top-tier company, so this was a very smart decision on the part of BCTS.

[_I3^RELATIVISM]

yes that is indeed good to see from the british columbia institutions. Scooter by the way is there any topic related to the forum software in specific? did you ever considered Discourse, and the bridging that allows with email, and chat services?

[Scooter]

I've considered it, but at the moment, Discourse needs to catch up with PHPBB. If I was going to switch, I'd want to be able to migrate all content. This board is running on a version of PHPBB that is too advanced for Discourse at the moment.

[_I3^RELATIVISM]

Given this ^^ discussion is a bit offtopic, I continued in:

https://replant.ca/phpBB3/viewtopic.php ... 375#p93375
Namaste Irelativism