Stihl FS560 Brushsaws

[Jimbo the Mook]

Anyone out there have any thoughts on the new Stihl 560's? I have a couple of well used 550's that are still running like tops, but I'm considering investing in a 560 for the extra jump in power; however, I'm a little concerned that Stihl hasn't hashed out the inevitable bugs of such a new model... I knew one person who ran one last year, and the drive shaft blew out on him after a week of use (perhaps too much power for the drive shaft to handle??) Anyone else have this problem... or any for that matter?

[Casper]

We had the 550's and we broke tons of drive shafts...like, a lot of em.

[Jimbo the Mook]

We had the 550's and we broke tons of drive shafts...like, a lot of em.

Hmmm, that's strange. I've had my two 550s for years and I've never had a problem with a drive shaft, or an angle drive blowing out. Not saying this is the root of the problem in your guys' case, but often less experienced brushers will fail to keep their blades sharp, and because of this, when they're trying to get through bigger wood they'll often resort to chopping at the tree with their dull blade, which will very quickly kill a drive shaft.
In the case of the person running the new 560, he was a very experienced brusher who always kept a sharp blade. The fact that his drive shaft blew after only a week of taking it out of the box, makes you think the drive shaft (probably the same drive shaft used in the 550s) just couldn't handle the extra torque of the 560?? Who knows though, maybe he just happened to buy the dud of the bunch. That's kinda what I'm hoping to find out by asking :-)

[Almaguin]

Keep using the 550s. Leave the 560 and 460 for that matter alone.

I predict a lot of shit coming down the pipe, from industry, with these models. Drive shafts aside, there are more challenges with these saws than that... good luck.

Power considered the same for 560 vs. 550 with .6 cc greater displacement on 560.

http://www.stihl.com/STIHL-power-tools- ... -saws.aspx

[Jimbo the Mook]

Thanks for the advice Almaguin! I've heard this now from a few people... I'm curious though, what these other challenges are? Did you experience them yourself, or know anyone who did?

Unfortunately it's getting mighty hard to find a 550 anymore since Stihl discontinued them – I think a lot of people are buying up as many of them as they can find, and squirreling them away out of fear of the 560s.

[Almaguin]

With the 550 if there is a carb issue, just pull, clean and throw back in... 25 minutes. Or buy a complete new Walbro (Stihl bought company so now "cheap"), $80 later... presto. Sure the 550 carb weaknesses are well known and the reasons why they get dirt inside should be clear to the concerned observant cutter.

Stihl has created a completely new situation, with the 460 et al, which is next to very difficult to field diagnose. Have a look inside and then ask your dealer if she has the diagnostic equipment to service this new series and if she has found a problem that was serviceable in a timely manner.

I am working through an issue presently and discussions with London have put me at the point of considering a major switch.

I may figure it out, I am not optimistic (about having a decent, quick and effective field maintenance skill with this new series), but perhaps it is just a dislike of change I am experiencing.

[BTW, broken drive shaft is from misuse.]

[newforest]

...so it sounds like the 560 is what folks here are starting to call a "chip saw" in that it's more like a fuel-injected engine run from a microprocessor?

I haven't been to my local saw shop yet this year, but last year he told me he is going to resist "chip saws" for as long as he can...

[newforest]

on a non-related tangent - is there much brushing work in Ontario? I'm trying to figure out some ways to illustrate the value of brushing to some foresters - Ontario has the same species mix as where I live. pm me please.

back to the 550/560 subject - I bet there are 550s sitting around in the States. hardly anyone runs brush saws here.

[steel8909]

on a non-related tangent - is there much brushing work in Ontario? I'm trying to figure out some ways to illustrate the value of brushing to some foresters - Ontario has the same species mix as where I live. pm me please.

back to the 550/560 subject - I bet there are 550s sitting around in the States. hardly anyone runs brush saws here.

HRI has some thinning going on, doubt you'll make any money with their rates though lol

[Jimbo the Mook]

Amalguin, Newforest, thanks for all the info!! I'm feeling quite scared of this new series too, from all I've heard about them. In fact, I actually just picked up another used 550 to add to the arsenal in order to prolong the inevitability of eventually having to buy a "chip saw". Maybe if I had an R2D2 unit by my side at all times, I wouldn't be so worried. But really, why the hell would I wanna spend $1400 on a saw that I couldn't possibly fix in the field if and when I needed to!!

Have a great seez all!!

[chrisdunn]

I'm done with everything stihl. All of these new power tools with the emissions bs is a joke.

They are making them heavier and harder to take apart and fix for the average joe.

[robertsonja]

Been running a 560 for a year now and havent had any major problems had the bolt that holds the handle on snap twice but its a cheap any easy fix. Just curious if anyone out there running a 560 noticed a 10-15 minute drop in the length of time a tank will run for and what would cause this to happen ?

[theBushman]

I find my 560 runs a little longer than a 550, but my habits may have a lot to do with that. When I got my saw, it was new with a broken handle bolt. Haven’t broken one myself.

[robertsonja]

Thats strange that it would have been broken already but its definately a piss off my spacing partner got rid of his 560 for that reason he broke it 3 times in a month but he tends to be very rough on the saws.

Any land management advice or anything to help a rookie along would be great i do alright now but i could be doing much better for sure

[newforest]

With the 550 if there is a carb issue, just pull, clean and throw back in... 25 minutes. Or buy a complete new Walbro (Stihl bought company so now "cheap"), $80 later... presto. Sure the 550 carb weaknesses are well known and the reasons why they get dirt inside should be clear to the concerned observant cutter.

Stihl has created a completely new situation, with the 460 et al, which is next to very difficult to field diagnose. Have a look inside and then ask your dealer if she has the diagnostic equipment to service this new series and if she has found a problem that was serviceable in a timely manner.

I am working through an issue presently and discussions with London have put me at the point of considering a major switch.

I may figure it out, I am not optimistic (about having a decent, quick and effective field maintenance skill with this new series), but perhaps it is just a dislike of change I am experiencing.

[BTW, broken drive shaft is from misuse.]

this is partially why I am acutally looking forward to my first fuel injected saw, eventually. a ways out from buying any new saws right now.

but I was talking them over with a couple dealers. one was trying to sell me a new saw....he swore up and down that I wouldn't need to buy an extra "module" - the plastic box that controls the injector. he says it handles everything, including changes in altitude, and comes with a 5 year warranty (Stihl). But then Lawn & Garden guys rarely understand production forestry work. "Just bring it back to the shop..." yeah, right.

On the other hand the "module" itself only costs $50. so it seems like a no-brainer to have one around as a spare part. when the inevitable performance problems hit, just switch out and problem solved. ? I like the sound of that.

but I know from experience with 1980s, early fuel injection designs in vehicle engines, things can be all about the sensors. how does the "module" know you are at a higher altitude today? where is that part? ditto for the all-important temperature sensor. probably injection control systems in the 21st century have solved a lot of problems I am familiar with.

but there has to be some sort of microprocessor chip in there somewhere....and chips need power, even if only in tiny amounts. where does that come from? a battery of some sort? a miniature alternator? low voltage induction? (been a long time since I passed Physics by drinking beer in the back of the lecture hall and taking guesses on the multiple-choice tests)


then over at a Husqy dealer, which so far only has fuel-injected chainsaws, not brush saws, I saw some interesting things. (though their current top-end non-injected brush-saw has the same power as the 560 but weighs 3 pounds less).

how do you diagnose your saw if a chip/brain/module/injector controller makes all the fuel/air decisions? just as with vehicles, there is a port in the engine that you plug a cable into. the other end has a USB connector. so you can plug your saw into your laptop to figure out what is happening. I saw the box that came from Husqvarna to the dealer to fix the new "Autotune" saws (as Husqy calls them). It was a small box that likely held just a cable, and a CD full of software.

The question I had is ... how much would the diagnostic kit cost?

That dealer was new to me, so I didn't bug them too much with questions. My regular saw mechanic is not happy about the new saws at all. Possibly because maintenance work could decline significantly?

On the other hand, I am not a fan of mechanics who I ask to replace A, B, & C on a saw and instead come back to me 3 weeks later with a response of "well I tweaked A some, now the saw runs fine." Sure, in your nicely chilled shop for the first five minutes. That is a lot different than working in the woods on a warm day miles and miles from pavement. So I try to avoid shops as much as possible, but I still can't sort out capped carb screws on my own at all, nor am perfect at re-adjusting mangled throttle cables.


[I have known people who have destroyed their saws via an inability to sharpen, but I handle that on my own saws even for other people running them. I ran into a new problem though ... this kid working for me wasn't unclipping the saw from the harness and setting the saw down independently. He was unclipping the harness from his body and then throwing off the shoulder straps with the saw still clipped to the harness, letting the saw land however, wherever (rocky tract). When I saw him do that I wanted to shit-can him instantly, but I have too much wrapped up in training him. I know he won't be around long-term after this fall's contracts though.]

[newforest]

Oh and I've asked two Stihl dealers so far to call their warehouse and ask if any 550s are left in there somewhere. They have both turned me down flat on even asking. One said the 560 came out in 2012 and the 550 wasn't in that catalog, so no way any are left.

but I don't quite believe him. I will ask the guy I know at home....he will want to sell one if he can, so he will at least make the phone call.

[SwampDonkey]

One thing 550 parts are still available and will be. My dealers have never refused to order parts for one.

As far as busting shafts, that happens on all saw brands I've been around. It happens when some dumb arse uses a dull saw like a sythe and also in over sized wood on the block with same dumb arse trying to whack away like it's 1" diameter brush. How many dead stop wallops do you think the shaft will stand? Companies really push beyond the thinning criteria on a lot of blocks to. 8" butted fir and a 3" cutting area, the middle 2" don't get cut. With me, if she don't snap and fall she stands, I'm not paid to tug and push on trees. Just paid to swing, severe and direct the fall. Angle drives last about 100 acres or maybe 150, depends on the wood size to.

I have an old 550, early 2000's, still cutting with it, but I maintain it myself and I have spare parts and manuals. Have cut 100's of acres with it. Yes, things need fixing and replaced once in awhile, the saw is certainly not in original condition. Most shops will not fix your saw right then and there. I only know of one, it's not Stihl, and he has most of the business. But as I said, I'm the only one that touches my saws anyway. It's like logging, you don't run to shops all the time to fix stuff unless you want to starve. If your going to make a living, you have to know how to use and maintain it.

I will be buying a new FS560 this spring, the old 550 will be a spare. I have every bit of confidence in the new line of saws. It's a shame they have to change models, nothing wrong with the old, the last 17 years or so. Government rebates/credits us anyway on income tax, so what does it matter in the long run?

[Meeshk]

A couple guys I worked with last year had the new saws, both very experienced. One had the 560 which I used for a couple days and I thought it was fantastic. The easy start is awesome and there is more power than a 550. It is a bit heavier though. Both guys also had the next model down, can't remember what the model was and it worked as well as a 550 and is way lighter. Only on the worst blocks where you practically need a falling ticket would the 560 come out, and then it was awesome. I still run a 550 because I didn't want to shell out for a new saw, but if I buy a new one I wouldn't hesitate to grab the newer models.

[SwampDonkey]

You do claim your saw and expenses for income tax don't you? So just buy it if you need it. Use the old saw as a spare.

[Meeshk]

You do claim your saw and expenses for income tax don't you? So just buy it if you need it. Use the old saw as a spare.

If I do more this season I will buy a new one, but my 550 was running great last year, and I have a spare powerhead already with a bunch of other random parts, so I just went cheap. It worked out until the last two days of the year when my saw caught fire when I started it at the end of the day, melting my pull start beyond repair. That's when I borrowed the 560.

The thing I forgot to say about the 560 is that it winds up A LOT faster than a 550. You hit the trigger and the blade seems to be instantly at full rpm, that makes it seem like it has more power and is a huge advantage.

[SwampDonkey]

I don't know, I find the 550 speeds up pretty quick for me. I can make it scream good if I need to take down a big clump of red maples (20+ stems on the clump). I don't even run full throttle in most thinning unless it's like dog hair thick in red spruce. I go well over an hour on a tank. My 550 still runs good to, but it's getting old. I maintain it very well though and it performs as good as a new one. But you just never know when something wears to the point where it's time to let it go. I've looked at the specs from Stihl on the power and there is little difference at all. The weight isn't much different either, except 1/2 lb plus extra fuel capacity weight. Here they are to compare. The fuel tank is bigger on the new 560 by about 200 cc. I here a lot of misinformation and bla bla. I just go to the source and skip the BS. :)

++++++++++++ FS550+++++++++++FS560+++++++++++
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
displacement+++3.81 cu in++++++++3.85 cu in
Power+++++++++3.7 hp@9400 rpm+++3.75 hp @ 9500 rpm
max rpm++++++12,500+++++++++++12,300
clutch engage++3250 rpm
Gear ratio+++++1:1.33
weight++++++++22 lbs++++++++++++22.5 lb

Your not gaining much. ;)

[Meeshk]

I don't know, I find the 550 speeds up pretty quick for me. I can make it scream good if I need to take down a big clump of red maples (20+ stems on the clump). I don't even run full throttle in most thinning unless it's like dog hair thick in red spruce. I go well over an hour on a tank. My 550 still runs good to, but it's getting old. I maintain it very well though and it performs as good as a new one. But you just never know when something wears to the point where it's time to let it go. I've looked at the specs from Stihl on the power and there is little difference at all. The weight isn't much different either, except 1/2 lb plus extra fuel capacity weight. Here they are to compare. The fuel tank is bigger on the new 560 by about 200 cc. I here a lot of misinformation and bla bla. I just go to the source and skip the BS. :)

++++++++++++ FS550+++++++++++FS560+++++++++++
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
displacement+++3.81 cu in++++++++3.85 cu in
Power+++++++++3.7 hp@9400 rpm+++3.75 hp @ 9500 rpm
max rpm++++++12,500+++++++++++12,300
clutch engage++3250 rpm
Gear ratio+++++1:1.33
weight++++++++22 lbs++++++++++++22.5 lb

Your not gaining much. ;)

Have you used the 560? It seemed obvious to us that it wound up faster than the 550's, and when I used it, it was awesome. Maybe because my 550 has so many hours on it is the reason, but the other guys loved the 540's or whatever the new model was below the 560 for the same reason. I usually like to try and keep mine going at pretty much full rpm if there are a lot of stems.

[SwampDonkey]

The specs speak for themselves. I have not run one yet, but that will soon change. I just won't be bragging about it. :) Like I say to some of the fellas, just because your making a lot of noise don't mean your cutting more ground. I work beside a fellow that revs the guts out of his saw all day and he takes 3 days to cut an acre, where I do it in one.

Actually the saw below the 560 is the 510, same saw, little less power. Most dealers will push the 460 as the next lower model. It was the same deal with the 550, the next was the 500. Look at your manual. They share the same parts lists and repair manual, which I have both of.

[Meeshk]

The specs speak for themselves. I have not run one yet, but that will soon change. I just won't be bragging about it. :) Like I say to some of the fellas, just because your making a lot of noise don't mean your cutting more ground. I work beside a fellow that revs the guts out of his saw all day and he takes 3 days to cut an acre, where I do it in one.

Actually the saw below the 560 is the 510, same saw, little less power. Most dealers will push the 460 as the next lower model. It was the same deal with the 550, the next was the 500. Look at your manual. They share the same parts lists and repair manual, which I have both of.

However you run it I think you will like it. If you like stretching your gas and going easy on your trigger then you will probably like the new saw even more than someone who keeps it revving. Whatever the specs say I think it winds up faster than the 550's.

[SwampDonkey]

Meeshk, about your old FS550. Have you taken the muffler off lately to check the exhaust port for carbon build up or even the screen in the muffler? You'd be surprised how strong that saw is when it gets air. ;)

[SwampDonkey]

I used a 560 last summer. The easy starting and the fact the filter can go for 3 - 4 days before cleaning is required is nice. The speed and snap was no different really than my old 550 actually. And at first, same things went wrong as far as power on the first few days of use. The plug type muffler screen plugged solid constantly, so that had to go to get air and power. And a note on the handle bar adjusting nut on the 'tower', it's convenient for sure, but undersized for bush work. I broke that sucker within a month. Also the so called 'Forestry Harnass', that was trashed within a month. I cut some ground in a week, minimum of 4 acres in thick softwood, and some sites have a lot of big fir that companies push in fill plants. The plant 3 -5 acres along the road and 50 acres is all natural, that's what DNR allows them to get away with on crown. On private, min 60 % of the site has to be planted, not just the dead zone along the road, before DNR will call it fill plant. And natural stocking has to below 60 %, and not 90% that they allow on crown. Actually 5 years ago, those roadside plantings were just considered natural with the block because 90%+ was natural once you go in 50 meters and strips go 250-600 meters long at the widest sections.

[newforest]

Looking to finally buy one of these in a few weeks. Of my four older brush saws, I finally got one to the point that compression is too weak to use it without a major rebuild. I'd rather just move into the Stihl saws. The remaining 3 are just too difficult to keep operating. My saw mechanics always want to put a band-aid on the fuel system and give them back to me instead of replacing every part the ethanol ever touched. After each band-aid the rotted lines/boots/intakes/seals just spring an air leak somewhere else.

The 560 should be in about the 4th model year with the M-Tronic system. It should be perfectly dialed-in by now I would think.

Should I still keep an eye on the muffler screen / consider deleting it?

[Almaguin]

Just to muddy the waters a bit for you Newforest, I am now very much a Swedish "modern" guy. I have been running Husky 555fx s for 3 years now. I will not return to German engineering unless Agnetha treats me badly.

Better angle drive +, a bit greater gas consumption -, better handle bar +, simpler to fix +++ and here in Can. about $100 lower sticker price +, which (price) should not of course be the main consideration in choosing. Actually, they have a better body harness also +, although I don't use theirs.

Sorry Stihl, I'll run my 362 for the firewood and deadfalls, but in brush saw PCT perscription, I am stuck on Husky...gl

[newforest]

That does muddy it a little.

I'm looking at it like this

Husqy plus

new Balance XT harnesses are sweet, I already have a couple
I run Husqy chainsaws and would prefer to stay with one brand
555fx 2.6 pounds lighter than FS560

Stihl plus

M-Tronic system should be all dialed in now
M-Tronic probably more fuel efficient
I like the Auto-Tune in my chainsaws, so far, but Husqy is not putting it in the clearing saws yet; and when they do I would rather wait till 2nd model year
I'm tired of the Husqy thumb-paddle trigger - easy to break, sore thumb after a long week

Tough call. Might buy one of each.

[Almaguin]

Newforest,

Yes correct, Husqvarna thumb paddle, is the correct idea, stronger thumb muscles vs. index/middle finger muscle group, but bad design; finger trigger model, which is available is better design, but more costly, marketing thing I guess. Paddle, whips may come up from below and "snag" in space and hand is "stretched" out a bit much, hence fatigue.

IMHO, I would carefully consider purchasing 2 different makes for the same job. Both saws are relatively good, but parts can't be switched in/out in a pinch. One could be used as a primary and second could be the "prince" in waiting, while the King does its job and its timeline.

Regards,

[newforest]

The paddle is a little wearing on the thumb but lately, cutting plenty of 5" Beech, hard Maple, and Ironwood, I leave the biggest ones and pick up a chainsaw after each two tanks through the clearing saw. That makes for a nice break. I wouldn't do that in another species mix and am really looking forward to getting out of this high density Ironwood on a few more days.

A bigger problem with the paddles is how fragile they are. I've had small widow-makers break them twice (the spring inside) and broke another one in transit. Weak point in the design.

The point of buying one of each would be to figure out which one to pick for a 3rd new saw. One of my Husqy 345s is already a parts saw for the other two, that is an advantage at the end, sure.

I don't work with the same wage base as in Canada - I'll never ever be able to just hire someone with their own $1,400 saw.

I'm leaning towards the Stihl the most though.

[newforest]

Almaguin was 100% correct on this one, and I feel like I took $1400 and set it on fire. I told my Stihl dealer on day one of owing one of these that my particular saw had problems, and it has been a battle ever since. It is only the second most expensive item Stihl sells, and the 11th saw I have purchased in my life, but they act like I am a home-owner complaining that my new electric chainsaw can't cut down a National Champion Oak tree.

After a few other dead ends I currently think there is a manufacturing defect in the carb, OR "The Module" or whatever you call it. More likely in the carb. If the jet that injects the fuel wasn't manufactured just exactly perfectly, and who hasn't heard of manufacturing perfection in whatever country Walbro currently lives in - how can "The Module" compensate for that? I don't think the system includes what is called an "O2 Sensor" in a vehicle; i.e. nothing reads the exhaust for a 'too rich' situation. But something is making my saw run far, far too rich as it has reached the point that the plug is fouled before the first quart of fuel is burned using a new plug. And that's on Stihl to fix. I really didn't think "The Module" would be a problem, four years into these saws being on the market.

But my local dealer is a clueless idiot and the distributor in-between him and Stihl USA corporate also is extremely un-helpful. They have had the saw back for 6 weeks now, after I did manage to run it for 50 hours by taking the muffler screen out. But they refuse to simply replace the carb. They claim to "know these saws well" but I seriously doubt anyone in Stihl USA at any level has ever used one to cut wood for more than ten minutes, if that.

My next saw will be a Husqy 555Fx. Leave it to Husqy to put the same model # on a brush saw and a chain saw. My new Husqy 550 XP and 562 XP chainsaws can handle the pre-commercial hardwood thinning I am doing currently just fine; the diameter classes involved are beyond brush-saw capability anyway. But next summer I will be back in the small stuff, with kids who have never held a saw in their hands before.

[SwampDonkey]

I can't understand why they will not assist or warrant the saw in some way. We use a lot of these saws in the bush up here, I have never seen that kind of service. Someone doesn't want business too bad. The only thing that really goes after months of daily use is a clutch, hand bar nut, shaft or possibly a front end and maybe a guard gets chipped in maple clumps. They go on all the brands. This is because we are in a lot of bigger trees than we should be. Heck, I've even had blades replaced when I told the dealer teeth broke and they said there was a recall. No hassles.

Anyone that doesn't break those parts mentioned on a Husky isn't thinning much as a professional. They break them on our crew.

[newforest]

I left the saw with the dealer while I am in the south for the winter. The last thing he told me was he needed a better laptop to be able to run the diagnostic software. In the USA, you somewhat purchase a piece of Stihl equipment from 3 separate businesses - Stihl USA, a regional distributor, and a local dealer. None of the 3 seem to want to step up and replace expensive parts on a very expensive saw, they all want to pass the buck to one of the other businesses. I think it is a simple manufacturing defect that slipped through quality control and this shouldn't be a big deal. There should be a new / working saw waiting for me when I get home in the spring.

That small local dealer is just too small - they don't even stock most of Stihl's "pro" models because their customers (farmers) don't buy them. I should have just gone to a higher volume, experienced dealer with a lot of logger customers, but those are few and far between. In the 4th model year of production of this very popular saw (outside the USA, where these are rarely used), I didn't expect any major issues with one.

My Husqy dealer quit carrying Stihl some 12 years ago over battles with the regional distributor business that they purchased from at the wholesale level. They are the #1 Husqy dealer in my home state.

In the meantime my ten+ year old Husqy brush-saws have been getting me through non chain-saw jobs (lately working in mostly 6-8" stuff, or out planting or working with a machete on some herbicide release work, where I only cut blackberry and bleed all day), but only by making one into a parts saw for the other saws. Worn-out gear teeth on one shaft became the parts saw. One likely just doesn't have enough compression left to be worth repairing without a total engine rebuild. I mostly broke the trigger systems and went through lots of struggles with learning the fuel system one aged part at a time. I will still get more use out of them, but of the four I have, I can never predict how many of them will be running two weeks later. They are just too worn-out.

This summer I will buy one of the current biggest Husqy model; it doesn't seem like they will ever put Auto-Tune in those saws. After that with one of each running I will decide which to buy again. The 3 extra pounds of the Stihl or the paddle trigger on the Husqy, tough call.

But then I can do a lot of sites with a 50cc pro chain-saw, the Husqy 550XP has been outstanding for that so far.

[Scooter]

Here's a brush saw question for newforest/tnalp/wainwright, or anyone else who wants to chime in.

I've just been skimming the Stihl website, and also this thread. I had no idea that there were so many models available.

Background: I believe my saw back in New Brunswick is a 550, if I remember correctly. I only used it for a couple days last winter, and before that, probably two years previously. So I'm not 100% certain that it's a 550. Also, I was using a pair of saws here in Prince George for the last few days, cleaning up brushed-in roadways, ie. mostly thin red alder, aspen, pine, etc. The saws I was using were a 360 and 460.

I think I'm going to be doing a fair amount of brush saw work on one of my own properties this winter. Possibly 30+ days. I may also have a helper. Because of that, I'm thinking about buying another saw for this person to use, and I'll keep using the 550. However, I want one that is small, ie. suitable for someone who is about 5' 6" and 125 pounds. Something that this person (someone who is comfortable with planting work but not a professional brusher, and who has never used a saw before) will be able to pick up and use comfortably for 5-6 hours per day doing casual cutting work (we're just tidying up my property, definitely not production work). There wouldn't be any hardwoods being cut, and even the "thick" stuff that we'd be cutting would be maximum 1" diameter, soft wood like red spruce, balsam fir, and aspen. So ideally, something very light and also easy to start (although to be honest, I doubt that we'd go out and do any work if it was colder than -5 degrees).

Any thoughts that you might have would be appreciated. Also, on a side note, do you use a different type of saw if you're doing production work on really steep ground, say thirty degrees or steeper? Something lighter and shorter? Or do you shorten the shaft on a full-size saw somehow?

[mwainwright]

I’ve never used a saw smaller than the 460, but for light cutting in the 1” diameter range I would think just about any saw that you can put a circular blade on would work just fine. I usually don’t stray from the 550, just because it’s what I know and suits the jobs I do, but a lot of brushers seem to prefer their saws a lot smaller. Those little shindaiwas are one that I see often, I’m sure someone on here could tell you more about those. As for production work on steep ground, my preference is to switch to a small chainsaw, usually 50cc or less.

[Scooter]

Thanks Mike.

[Tnalp]

if appropriate in the steeps you would want a 40cc type brush saw with throttle on the shaft so it can be used without being hooked up to you or a harness.
many a times i've used one, one handed to reach out quite far.
make sure to take the spark arrestor screen out as soon as you have it..

[newforest]

steep = chainsaw, for me. 'steep' frequently includes rocks, and then you need careful control of the blade around rocks. that gets a little more challenging on slopes. I will be thinning Red Spruce on some mountain-tops in West Virginia next year, though the diameter classes are often brush-saw size, the micro-topography is +/- one foot, here there and everywhere, cuz of all the rocks, and every minor kickback mistake that wouldn't matter on flat ground would hit a rock there.

also felling direction becomes more important on steep ground, and though you can definitely 'fell' trees where you want them with a brush saw, it is not as simple with a brush saw as compared to a chain saw. especially with the almost always straight & tall Spruce stems.

(interestingly, to me, is that in the Upper Peninsula of Michigan, Spruce generally has dry, stiff, hard slash that won't generally break easily at all. in the Lower Peninsula loggers straight hate the species but it is rare there. the mountain where I will cut it in WV gets 60" of rain a year as it is a 'rain front' mountain - double what I experience everywhere in Michigan. All of the dead wood material on that mountain is so rotten you can push through the branch stubs with your hand usually, and the standing dead Spruce stems can usually be just pushed over with no need to cut them at all)


I think Stihl shops I visit, most of which have never even seen an FS 560 or any of it's cousins, do routinely stock and sell the FS 110. I think the 111 is more of a 'production' model with a bigger gas tank but otherwise the same. It would handle mass quantities of 1" material I would think. 30cc class.

[newforest]

I don't think I told the conclusion of my battle with a brand new FS560 sadly purchased at a tractor dealer. The dealer and distributor dug in their heels for weeks and told me I didn't know how a brush-saw worked on my 5th such saw purchased in my life (and with 2 new chainsaws purchased that same year). I knew they had never touched such a saw. I left my home state and told them it had better be working a few months later, or I would drive down to Virginia Beach and walk the saw through the front doors of Stihl USA. It is the 2nd most expensive product Stihl makes.

When I got home that spring, they handed me the saw and it did then run perfectly. No more surging all the time, and no more fouling the plug inside of 15 minutes. They told me all they did was push the "factory reset" via the diagnostic software, but I didn't quite believe them; I suspect they replaced something.

I did pick up a spare spark arrestor screen just in case anyone asks; it is a term in most of my saw contracts that all equipment have one. But I have no plans to put it back in.

It has been a beast ever since. I haven't purchased any more saws since; I gave up on the idea of having anyone help me. The people who could do it and want to do it can't get free of their regular gigs for a few weeks or months, because they all need help at those.

The idiots at Stihl USA supply the FS560 with the "Deluxe" harness, rather than the "Forestry" harness, because the "Deluxe" harness costs $5 more, so that surely must be the "best" one. It does not include a buckle across the chest like the Forestry harness does, and does a piss poor job of distributing the 23 pound weight of the saw. Useless.

I ultimately run my 560 with the latest, heaviest duty harness from Husqy, the "Balance XT" and that is an excellent harness.

But have been mostly living on the 550 XP chainsaw this year. Just came off a job that had 99.99% Hard Maple (in that family at least, scattered Ironwood, Birch and Elm though in very small amounts) - exactly 2 Red Maple stems on 39 acres. The least amount of that species I have ever seen across many states and many timber types.

[newforest]

I noticed in the 2018 catalog that Husqy finally put Auto Tune in one of their brush saws, though not the biggest model yet. I would never want the first year machine of such an endeavor; nor do I expect to be in the market for any saws next year. But any reviews of it appreciated.